(no subject)
MOAR RELATIONSHIP DUMPS
Luke/Mukuro- uhh. orz. This MAY change depending on what Van says about the relationship after Luke finishes talking to him. But as things are now:
Well. Luke discovered Mukuro is a sadist. He doesn't know that's the word for it. But he knows Mukuro admitted that he enjoys hurting people. Onceupon a time Luke would have chalked this up to 'likes fighting', which is an exhileration and a challenge, and Luke likes it too. But in their conversation it was very obviously 'likes hurting' which... isn't even just hurting his enemies but his friends too. It didn't occur to Luke to ask if Mukuro would enjoy hurting HIM, since Luke's sense of entitlement more or less went down with Akzeriuth, but if he thought about it he'd assume so. Luckily, Luke assumes he can beat Mukuro in a fight, so he never really worries about his own safety.
ANYWAY. While he moved on from the subject, the sadist thing really bothers him. He doesn't have any way to rationalize that and it means accepting that something is just very wrong with Mukuro, something incomprehensible and inexcusable to him. He could understand, on some level, Mukuro wanting to lash out to the world that had hurt him. But enjoying the pain of your friends is a different kind of wrong and... he can't rationalize it. He can DEAL with it, cuz god knows Luke's dealt with plenty of other messed up things. But it isn't okay.
NONETHELESS he left the conversation feeling pretty happy. He can manage this for a few reasons: Luke HAS learned to... rationalize a lot of Mukuro's actions. It may not be entirely fair, but Mukuro is, regardless of all faults, an important friend. He could forgive Van USING HIM TO KILL TEN THOUSAND PEOPLE, and while Luke never forgives Van for this, he doesn't fixate on it (in a "I hate you Master!" sense) throughout the game. He addresses it once and moves on. This is similar to how Luke reacts to "Mukuro is a sadist", he's not okay with it and will be very un-okay with it every time it comes up, but dwelling on it won't get him anywhere. And UNLIKE Van, he knows Mukuro is making an effort, in his... Mukuro way, to be better. Luke is losing patience for a lot of Mukuro's bullshit, and more often takes the "cut it out or I'm not going to deal with you anymore" mentality that Tear topped him with, but Luke's still far from stone hearted and making the attempt means a lot to him, he's physically incapable of not being supportive. The SECOND thing is that, well. Lancia is okay. Lancia might have nearly died and that is bad, but Luke almost dies on a regular basis (meta gaming), so a NEAR death doesn't bother him that much, on top of that Lancia is okay WITH it, he was clearly far more upset about Mukuro hurting his friends than hurting him, something Luke can understand, and as such he doesn't feel like he has to be deeply permanantly upset on Lancia's behalf.
Blahblah that was very rambly and I haven't even gotten anywhere yet really. BASICALLY, stuff has changed, though not necessarily recently. Luke has just learned to top more. He doesn't think about it that often, but he has learned that Mukuro values his company and friendship and will make an effort to keep Luke happy to maintain them. Luke has only ACTIVELY used this against Mukuro once, a while ago after Mukuro stabbed Ikki for no damn reason. But it works in his favor nearly all the time now. The only shift is that Luke accepts less bullshit. But he also, courtesy of TRUTH POST, KNOWS that Mukuro is trying. And that, for whatever Mukuro reason, 'trying his best' doesn't and probably can't equate to 'I won't do it anymore', but... Mukuro IS unquestionably getting better. It's just a matter of if he gets better before he does something Luke won't forgive him for.
Luke also has a vague sort-of crush neither of us are really addressing because he's unlikely to act on it. But it's there and he's actually grown up enough to realize it. (Luke has vague, sort-of crushes on Natalia and Guy too and is cool with it. I'm not entirely sure he's equated it to sex in any way yet, which is probably why he can be zen).
Van/Luke **SPOILERS IN THISUN**- This may very well earn some status updating after Van and Luke finish talking, as it will mark the end of their FIRST WHOLE CONVERSATION. But, for now, here is how it plays out.
Luke is not capable of hating Van, disrespecting him or really being more than deeply hurt and frustrated at him. He's just... not. Luke loves people too wholely and regardless of Duke Fabre getting his head out of his ass, Van was his surrogate father figure his entire life, and you know, a guy who did his best to... well. Brainwash Luke. And it worked. And he even KNOWS it worked. But he can't change the fact that he loves Van and doesn't really want to, he just feels guilty about it whenever people point out that, you know, he shouldn't.
There is still a lot to respect about Van if you can get past the whole tried to destroy the world thing. Which... Luke can. Lolo. Luke is very well aware that he's still young and stupid, and Van is still intelligent and decisive and naturally a mentor. He THINKS he can trust Van to give him good at advice on pretty much anything that isn't the Score or. the fate of the world. And at the very least Luke can LISTEN to it, as he's gotten very good at thinking for himself while still listening to other people's opinions and advice.
SO WHAT I'M GETTIN AT HERE. Is that Luke still values Master Van and... he won't ever NOT. He does understand that even if Van recognizes him as human, he only does because Luke... killed a lot of people and went through a lot of strife to reach him, which Luke really doesn't consider good qualifications to be recognized as human to begin with. On top of that he was only created to be used, and even if Van sees him as human, finally, it doesn't mean Van sees him as a pupil or... son. The way Luke always believed and wished for. Luke is... okay with this. It sucks but he's zen about it. All things considered, Van's opinion on him should be very low on his list of concerns and thus isn't something he'll openly address (even if it does bother him yes). But it... doesn't change his opinion on Van. Which is why Luke can't not love Van no matter how little Van sees in him.
As for... how he sees Van. Van is actually one of the few people Luke considers himself equal to on a lot of levels, despite still thinking of him as "Master". He defeated Van, saved the world, died for his cause, learned and defeated him with Albert Style Artes, and basically did a lot of the same things Van did and was the one ultimately successful. In a lot of ways, Van is still his superior! He's smarter, lived longer, CREATED HIM, and had a lot of master plans going on. But in the end Luke did confront and defeat him, and this leaves with a certain amount of confidence when dealing with Van. As much as he loves him, he's past being manipulated or used or lied to or having that love turned against him. As far as interactions, Van gets the same amount of awkward humility Luke shows anyone, but more familiar confidence than Luke shows people who he isn't close to, and hasn't been through a lot with.
Uh. THIS WAS NOT VERY ORGANIZED. But the short of it is that Luke loves and respects and wants Van's approval always. At the same time has a good sense of reality regarding the situation and treats it the way it is and not the way he wishes it were. And there... aren't any hard feelings so much as hurt ones, but he's ACCEPTED THOSE.
Ticky/Radu- Radu honey I'm sorry but Ticky's opinon hasn't changed and probably won't. He LIKES Radu, overall. The Baron is in a positive light for him, because he's good company and doesn't get on his case about all of the dying. But he's not particularly interested or attached either. Very much a companionable once in a while chat and someone he might do a favor for thanks to the nice opinion he has on him, but not much else.
Luke/Mukuro- uhh. orz. This MAY change depending on what Van says about the relationship after Luke finishes talking to him. But as things are now:
Well. Luke discovered Mukuro is a sadist. He doesn't know that's the word for it. But he knows Mukuro admitted that he enjoys hurting people. Onceupon a time Luke would have chalked this up to 'likes fighting', which is an exhileration and a challenge, and Luke likes it too. But in their conversation it was very obviously 'likes hurting' which... isn't even just hurting his enemies but his friends too. It didn't occur to Luke to ask if Mukuro would enjoy hurting HIM, since Luke's sense of entitlement more or less went down with Akzeriuth, but if he thought about it he'd assume so. Luckily, Luke assumes he can beat Mukuro in a fight, so he never really worries about his own safety.
ANYWAY. While he moved on from the subject, the sadist thing really bothers him. He doesn't have any way to rationalize that and it means accepting that something is just very wrong with Mukuro, something incomprehensible and inexcusable to him. He could understand, on some level, Mukuro wanting to lash out to the world that had hurt him. But enjoying the pain of your friends is a different kind of wrong and... he can't rationalize it. He can DEAL with it, cuz god knows Luke's dealt with plenty of other messed up things. But it isn't okay.
NONETHELESS he left the conversation feeling pretty happy. He can manage this for a few reasons: Luke HAS learned to... rationalize a lot of Mukuro's actions. It may not be entirely fair, but Mukuro is, regardless of all faults, an important friend. He could forgive Van USING HIM TO KILL TEN THOUSAND PEOPLE, and while Luke never forgives Van for this, he doesn't fixate on it (in a "I hate you Master!" sense) throughout the game. He addresses it once and moves on. This is similar to how Luke reacts to "Mukuro is a sadist", he's not okay with it and will be very un-okay with it every time it comes up, but dwelling on it won't get him anywhere. And UNLIKE Van, he knows Mukuro is making an effort, in his... Mukuro way, to be better. Luke is losing patience for a lot of Mukuro's bullshit, and more often takes the "cut it out or I'm not going to deal with you anymore" mentality that Tear topped him with, but Luke's still far from stone hearted and making the attempt means a lot to him, he's physically incapable of not being supportive. The SECOND thing is that, well. Lancia is okay. Lancia might have nearly died and that is bad, but Luke almost dies on a regular basis (meta gaming), so a NEAR death doesn't bother him that much, on top of that Lancia is okay WITH it, he was clearly far more upset about Mukuro hurting his friends than hurting him, something Luke can understand, and as such he doesn't feel like he has to be deeply permanantly upset on Lancia's behalf.
Blahblah that was very rambly and I haven't even gotten anywhere yet really. BASICALLY, stuff has changed, though not necessarily recently. Luke has just learned to top more. He doesn't think about it that often, but he has learned that Mukuro values his company and friendship and will make an effort to keep Luke happy to maintain them. Luke has only ACTIVELY used this against Mukuro once, a while ago after Mukuro stabbed Ikki for no damn reason. But it works in his favor nearly all the time now. The only shift is that Luke accepts less bullshit. But he also, courtesy of TRUTH POST, KNOWS that Mukuro is trying. And that, for whatever Mukuro reason, 'trying his best' doesn't and probably can't equate to 'I won't do it anymore', but... Mukuro IS unquestionably getting better. It's just a matter of if he gets better before he does something Luke won't forgive him for.
Luke also has a vague sort-of crush neither of us are really addressing because he's unlikely to act on it. But it's there and he's actually grown up enough to realize it. (Luke has vague, sort-of crushes on Natalia and Guy too and is cool with it. I'm not entirely sure he's equated it to sex in any way yet, which is probably why he can be zen).
Van/Luke **SPOILERS IN THISUN**- This may very well earn some status updating after Van and Luke finish talking, as it will mark the end of their FIRST WHOLE CONVERSATION. But, for now, here is how it plays out.
Luke is not capable of hating Van, disrespecting him or really being more than deeply hurt and frustrated at him. He's just... not. Luke loves people too wholely and regardless of Duke Fabre getting his head out of his ass, Van was his surrogate father figure his entire life, and you know, a guy who did his best to... well. Brainwash Luke. And it worked. And he even KNOWS it worked. But he can't change the fact that he loves Van and doesn't really want to, he just feels guilty about it whenever people point out that, you know, he shouldn't.
There is still a lot to respect about Van if you can get past the whole tried to destroy the world thing. Which... Luke can. Lolo. Luke is very well aware that he's still young and stupid, and Van is still intelligent and decisive and naturally a mentor. He THINKS he can trust Van to give him good at advice on pretty much anything that isn't the Score or. the fate of the world. And at the very least Luke can LISTEN to it, as he's gotten very good at thinking for himself while still listening to other people's opinions and advice.
SO WHAT I'M GETTIN AT HERE. Is that Luke still values Master Van and... he won't ever NOT. He does understand that even if Van recognizes him as human, he only does because Luke... killed a lot of people and went through a lot of strife to reach him, which Luke really doesn't consider good qualifications to be recognized as human to begin with. On top of that he was only created to be used, and even if Van sees him as human, finally, it doesn't mean Van sees him as a pupil or... son. The way Luke always believed and wished for. Luke is... okay with this. It sucks but he's zen about it. All things considered, Van's opinion on him should be very low on his list of concerns and thus isn't something he'll openly address (even if it does bother him yes). But it... doesn't change his opinion on Van. Which is why Luke can't not love Van no matter how little Van sees in him.
As for... how he sees Van. Van is actually one of the few people Luke considers himself equal to on a lot of levels, despite still thinking of him as "Master". He defeated Van, saved the world, died for his cause, learned and defeated him with Albert Style Artes, and basically did a lot of the same things Van did and was the one ultimately successful. In a lot of ways, Van is still his superior! He's smarter, lived longer, CREATED HIM, and had a lot of master plans going on. But in the end Luke did confront and defeat him, and this leaves with a certain amount of confidence when dealing with Van. As much as he loves him, he's past being manipulated or used or lied to or having that love turned against him. As far as interactions, Van gets the same amount of awkward humility Luke shows anyone, but more familiar confidence than Luke shows people who he isn't close to, and hasn't been through a lot with.
Uh. THIS WAS NOT VERY ORGANIZED. But the short of it is that Luke loves and respects and wants Van's approval always. At the same time has a good sense of reality regarding the situation and treats it the way it is and not the way he wishes it were. And there... aren't any hard feelings so much as hurt ones, but he's ACCEPTED THOSE.
Ticky/Radu- Radu honey I'm sorry but Ticky's opinon hasn't changed and probably won't. He LIKES Radu, overall. The Baron is in a positive light for him, because he's good company and doesn't get on his case about all of the dying. But he's not particularly interested or attached either. Very much a companionable once in a while chat and someone he might do a favor for thanks to the nice opinion he has on him, but not much else.