56 - Principles.

[conductyourself]

A principled man is in danger of losing an ideological war. His opponents' forces outnumber his own and stand ready to defend their beliefs with lethal force. So, he storms their palace at night, steals a number of supplies and takes several innocent hostages. In the days following, he carries out a successful seige campaign against that same

Comments

[veritaphobia]

That might depend. What was the war over?

[conductyourself]

The usual. Some people wanted rights of some kind, and some other people didn't want the first group to have said rights.

[veritaphobia]

Would the principled man call it a win?

[conductyourself]

Does that matter?

[implemented]

No.

That's the problem with principles.

[conductyourself]

I think most people would disagree.

[implemented]

Disagree my assessment of the situation? Or that principles -- in general -- are problematic?

[conductyourself]

The former; I'm sure a life without principles would be less complicated in the short term, at least.

[chosenfake]

[... This sounds kind of awful and familiar.]

If he didn't actually betray anything he believed in then he would have won in a sense. But war isn't black and white. The people on the other side are trying just as hard for their own survival, so they'll find a way to fight back eventually, even if it takes years.

No one can win something like that.

If he really cared about what happened to his people and his country, I think he would have found a different way to go about things. [He's clearly talking from personal experience.] Sometimes peace talks aren't an option. I know that. But maybe the root of the problem- the difference in ideals- was somewhere else. If it's something that endangers a whole world, then that would take priority over fighting a war.

... Did that make any sense? I think I lost the point. I'm no good with riddles.

[conductyourself]

[ Ponders. This guy seems like he's got something specific in mind. Except that Clef is still trying to fit it into the allegory somehow and... sorta failing. ]

I don't think I follow. What do you mean when you say that the difference in ideals might be somewhere else?

[chosenfake]

I mean an external influence. If it's an ideological war, that means the sides disagree about something bigger than territory or resources, right? What if something is making them fight? If- if it's supposedly fate or a religion, [or both] then that's wrong. And if the other side's leader is planning something terrible that would destroy the other country or the whole world, then what would make him to go that far? Who's controlling that guy?

You can't just write off a war as justified. People's lives are at stake. It's important to look deeper, to get to the root of the cause, because otherwise peace will never happen.

[conductyourself]

What if part of the problem is with the system itself? Manipulation and intrigue are a part of any government, and religion is an important part of culture and human nature. Try to do away with either one and you will go down in history as a tyrant.

I think that a good deal of the problem is that the people who declare war are never the ones on the front lines. They are not the ones whose villages will be ravaged, and they are not the ones who will die.

On the other hand, we can't have government officials who also happen to be soldiers or spend most of their time in small villages that are likely to be raided. That could cause some logistical problems.

[pharles_at_life]

That doesn't sound very principled to me.

[conductyourself]

Indeed not.

[pharles_at_life]

Do you want to talk about it?

[conductyourself]

... I don't know where I'd start.

[beforehistime]

...If surrendering to methods that go against his principles can be considered a bitter victory.

[conductyourself]

It is a kind of victory. I was more wondering if he would be the same person afterward.

[beforehistime]

Probably not, my friend. If nothing else because any truly principled man would be left wondering whether his methods were worth the outcome.

[conductyourself]

That's the problem with war. The sorts of people who win tend to be very violent.