damn. i always worry about this kind of stuff when i bring my boyfriend out with me to the queer scene. i wonder if we'd even get in the door if i didn't have ten years of queer activism and didn't know numerous 'key players' out and about. and i find myself even playing the pronoun game sometimes - in front of fellow queers. i mean, i don't give a shit what straight people think of me, but here i am being stealth among queers. it's a mess.
i mentioned my boyfriend at a queer event last month and promptly got introduced to someone as straight. i'm still sore about it.
Jeebus. that's SO fucking uncool. I mean... I think I'm even angrier cus I have so many years of notched up activism, Dublin is small. I can get recognised by every bloody school mate or whatever and get outed in any straight bar in Dublin but when i go to a Gay bar it's like a safe place .. except.. it's not anymore.
I hate this idea of havign to have a 'queer pass' to get into something. God I hate it. I hate the idea of hetero privelage and the lines we draw. I would honestly NEVER give someone hassle for being straight or assume they were.
Why the fuck does it matter how I ID? Just the way no one should care if you're in the 'straight' bar kissing.
one of my pet rants is about gay bars that turn people away at the door for not looking queer enough. oh, i could go on forever, so i'm trying to hold back just now. but it is something i was musing on just earlier tonight, how i find it really hard to question bi invisibility and/or challenge biphobia sometimes, because the cumulative effect of all this is really disempowering and just serves to remind me that this LGBT community is not really about or for me, despite its name - it gets reduced to 'lesbian/gay' often enough anyway, and i have to guess whether i'm actually welcome or whether i've been deliberately left out
( ... )
I think me ranting about being bi right now would be a bad thing. Cus Im about to go to bed and dont wanna get all riled up. But I get what you mean about 'deliberately left out'.
actually. I'd so be up for that. my email is myliver at gmail dot com and I'd be down with doin something. Especially if it's for a scottish mag cus I REALLY want to try liase (oooh big word) with more Irish, Scottish and English people. I want to meet more FTMs close by, I'm the only out and persuing transition FTM I bloody know in Ireland! So yeah, drop me a line for sure. Would love to. Also actually talking to you ahotu some of this might be good, organising Pink training (a big national LGBT conference) this year and learning about other speakrs from other countries and exchanging contacts etc might be really good and helpful.
It just kinda blew me away. It reminded me of why I used to pick up girls in straight bars instead of gay bars when I was but a wee youngin.. an underage fiesty youngin at that. I always scored more at straight bars... might have something to do with pheremones, who bloody knows but I've always had the charm to pull the bi and 'striaght' ladies and I remmember not being in the gay bars cus people would hate that I liked men, that I had loads of straight guy friends, that I didn't ID as a lesbian. I just don't bloody get it...
although from their POV you were probably a creepy straight guy lookin' to get your girl into some three way girl on girl action. it doesn't suck any less, but they perceived you as a threat to their space, and were trying to protect it from a scary hetero man :(
i get the same thing too, people either assume i'm straight or gay depending on the context. but i'm neither :/
*shudder* cus heaven forbid I just be a bi guy looking to have normal pint. And HOW would making out like mad infront of me make me unhappy if I wanted all dem lesbians for de hot treesome action. *rubs thighs*
I wasn't messin with their space. I was having a pint. I'm a bi dude, I shouldn't need a pass to say 'It's ok, Im queer. Your space is fine.' Hell. That space is my damned space as much as it is theirs. That's what hurts I guess. LG'B' my arse.
well clearly they were trying to say, we're into each other not YOU. in their defense, i can remember during my "lesbian" days getting hit on by MANY guys who assumed that because i was into chicks i wanted to do it with his girlfriend while he watched.
and yeah i get what you're saying in general. the assumption is that because you're a guy into girls and you're in "gay" space you're a threat. it's not true in this case, but i think in their experience it is probably generally true :(
what happened TOTALLY sucks and isn't right, but unfortunately it's something we have to deal with as we get perceived as male more often :/
Yeah I get it. It's just more a 'bi' peeve then trans peeve and I was more intrigued how I didn't feel happy at being seen as male but was angry at being treated like that cus I was male. Hell Matt, in MY girl on girl days I hated men assuming that I wanted to do them or would have a threesome cus Im kissing some other girl - and I was bi identified then too! If I had been a girl with her boyfriend i would have gotten the same reaction. I get them being defensive if I was being over touchy feely or being lusty in their direction but I was being totally normal, over the other side of the room casually chatting. I wasn't winking or flirting or exhibiting my gf or being rude. Just sitting on my ass minding my own damned business. If a lesbian couple were doing the same and got weird looks and were provoked in a 'straight' bar it would be an outrage and they could (and have before in Dublin) hold a court case over it.
that's fucked in the ways you've discussed above, but it's also funny in that the Front Lounge always seemed pretty mixed to me. of all the places for homos to get into territorial pissing...
(I'm being tongue in cheek, but I am honestly sorry you had to encounter that bullshit love. xo, Oli)
fuck those bitches! You'd think they'd be a little more fucking open about relationships but they have a total bias now and it doesnt make em any beter people.
*sips her tea* i'd egg a car of it wasnt for the LA- Dublin travel and, ya know, spreading the hate...bitches >:O
Comments 18
i mentioned my boyfriend at a queer event last month and promptly got introduced to someone as straight. i'm still sore about it.
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I mean... I think I'm even angrier cus I have so many years of notched up activism, Dublin is small. I can get recognised by every bloody school mate or whatever and get outed in any straight bar in Dublin but when i go to a Gay bar it's like a safe place .. except.. it's not anymore.
I hate this idea of havign to have a 'queer pass' to get into something. God I hate it. I hate the idea of hetero privelage and the lines we draw. I would honestly NEVER give someone hassle for being straight or assume they were.
Why the fuck does it matter how I ID? Just the way no one should care if you're in the 'straight' bar kissing.
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actually. I'd so be up for that.
my email is myliver at gmail dot com and I'd be down with doin something. Especially if it's for a scottish mag cus I REALLY want to try liase (oooh big word) with more Irish, Scottish and English people. I want to meet more FTMs close by, I'm the only out and persuing transition FTM I bloody know in Ireland! So yeah, drop me a line for sure. Would love to. Also actually talking to you ahotu some of this might be good, organising Pink training (a big national LGBT conference) this year and learning about other speakrs from other countries and exchanging contacts etc might be really good and helpful.
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Never makes sense to me, really.
that sucks.
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It just kinda blew me away. It reminded me of why I used to pick up girls in straight bars instead of gay bars when I was but a wee youngin.. an underage fiesty youngin at that. I always scored more at straight bars... might have something to do with pheremones, who bloody knows but I've always had the charm to pull the bi and 'striaght' ladies and I remmember not being in the gay bars cus people would hate that I liked men, that I had loads of straight guy friends, that I didn't ID as a lesbian.
I just don't bloody get it...
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although from their POV you were probably a creepy straight guy lookin' to get your girl into some three way girl on girl action. it doesn't suck any less, but they perceived you as a threat to their space, and were trying to protect it from a scary hetero man :(
i get the same thing too, people either assume i'm straight or gay depending on the context. but i'm neither :/
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cus heaven forbid I just be a bi guy looking to have normal pint. And HOW would making out like mad infront of me make me unhappy if I wanted all dem lesbians for de hot treesome action. *rubs thighs*
I wasn't messin with their space. I was having a pint. I'm a bi dude, I shouldn't need a pass to say 'It's ok, Im queer. Your space is fine.' Hell. That space is my damned space as much as it is theirs. That's what hurts I guess. LG'B' my arse.
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and yeah i get what you're saying in general. the assumption is that because you're a guy into girls and you're in "gay" space you're a threat. it's not true in this case, but i think in their experience it is probably generally true :(
what happened TOTALLY sucks and isn't right, but unfortunately it's something we have to deal with as we get perceived as male more often :/
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Hell Matt, in MY girl on girl days I hated men assuming that I wanted to do them or would have a threesome cus Im kissing some other girl - and I was bi identified then too!
If I had been a girl with her boyfriend i would have gotten the same reaction.
I get them being defensive if I was being over touchy feely or being lusty in their direction but I was being totally normal, over the other side of the room casually chatting. I wasn't winking or flirting or exhibiting my gf or being rude. Just sitting on my ass minding my own damned business.
If a lesbian couple were doing the same and got weird looks and were provoked in a 'straight' bar it would be an outrage and they could (and have before in Dublin) hold a court case over it.
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(I'm being tongue in cheek, but I am honestly sorry you had to encounter that bullshit love. xo, Oli)
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*sips her tea* i'd egg a car of it wasnt for the LA- Dublin travel and, ya know, spreading the hate...bitches >:O
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