Good Lord.

[doctorcaligari]

Okay, I sure hope England doesn't lock down social media. Way to pour fuel on a fire. Because you know I'm sure none of the rioters will be reminded of Egypt or Iran or Syria.

Serious question - are the rioters in England "looting thugs" because their actions are qualitatively that different from those of revolutionaries throughout history, or

Comments

[sorceror]

I think they're being called "looting thugs" mostly because they are looting. And not doing anything else, at least not as far as I can tell.

They aren't marching on Westminster, or organizing to storm the Tower, or making unified demands of a political nature. As far as I know, they aren't even attacking banks. There doesn't seem to be any sort of political agenda at all, no slogans, no leaders, no specific grievances to be addressed. They're just smashing store windows in their own neighbourhoods, and grabbing what they can.

I don't think the racial issue comes in to it, really. Or at least, not in the way it has in past riots.

Although some people have been trying to link these riots with the recent austerity measures in the UK, that seems a tenuous connection at best. I've heard it said that the effect of these measures hasn't even been felt in those neighbourhoods yet, so it seems questionable to say that there's a link - not a direct one, at least.

[doctorcaligari]

Well, as I said, I'm not about to defend looting. And certainly not violence. (I also don't equate rioting with "political action" as the term is usually used, necessarily -- although I'll note that at least in the U.S., historically, rioting tended to coincide with more overtly political and/or productive expressions of discontent, so the phenomena are definitely linked. Also, such things are notoriously in the eye of the beholder. Somebody else's citizenry rioting is viewed through one lens, your own is something else. As far as I can tell, there's always been a significant overlap between rioters and revolutionaries. I think it's often the same rage underlying -- it's just whether it's channeled into organized resistance or incoherent violence at that particular moment

[sorceror]

It's true that this is getting far more attention than peaceful demonstrations do, unfortunately. However, I don't think it's the kind of attention that is going to result in positive change. I also doubt that there's any real connection between the 2000 peaceful protestors mentioned in the article - or the segment of society that they represent - and the looters

[doctorcaligari]

It's true that this is getting far more attention than peaceful demonstrations do, unfortunately. However, I don't think it's the kind of attention that is going to result in positive change.

Yep; it seems to be eliciting a big backlash/crackdown, in fact. (On the other hand, it has got people talking about the issues, eh.)

I also doubt that there's any real connection between the 2000 peaceful protestors mentioned in the article - or the segment of society that they represent - and the looters.

There might or might not be any overlap there, I have no idea. What is clear is that both groups are angry. (Or at least the marchers and the rioters both are. Don't know how much of the looting is just opportunistic.)

There does seem to be racial undercurrent to some of the violence, but I don't think it's just white vs non-white. That incident where three young men were killed while defending their neighbourhood was POC vs POC:

Yeah, I saw that one. Horrible.

And there was that poor Malaysian student who was mugged by a multi-ethnic

[vincentdamour]

They are looting 'cause there's nothing left to do for many of them. They are called looters partly because they are and partly because it's much easier to evade the problem if you do so. Then you don't have to adress the appalling conditions for the lower classes in England - in terms of education, job marked and future. Thatcher made it quite clear that social benefits and public education paved the road to hell why England ever since has kept it at a minimum.

I think Johnny Rotten said it best when describing why the punk rebelion started:

"We were always taught in school that 'Shakespeare's great and you're not!'"

V