This whole journal thing.

[dragonkal]

I've avoided this topic because I know I'm in the minority in my opinion, but that's never been a good reason to stay silent, has it?

Comments

[darkrosetiger]

I see them struggling to make sure they remain solvent in a sue-happy society with very very indistinct laws about free speech when it comes to all things sexual.

It wasn't about lawsuits. No one was threatened with being sued--the issue was that WfI threatened to go to LJ's advertisers and say that they allowed child porn. WfI's definition of "child porn" and "pedophile" is elastic enough to include just about anyone they don't like, especially gays, lesbians, and brown people.

No, LJ's not "in bed with a minority faction". But they are allowing an extremist hate group--a group that wouldn't be allowed to have an LJ community under the current TOS--to dictate their corporate policy and to have a greater say than those of us who are actually paying for their service.

You can't expect a journaling platform to be perfect in its policies about controversial material when it exists within a society filled with confusion, double standards, and litigious conundrums on the topic.I don't expect a journaling platform to be perfect. I can

[dragonkal]

No one was threatened with being sued--the issue was that WfI threatened to go to LJ's advertisers and say that they allowed child porn.

I appreciate the correction.

WfI's definition of "child porn" and "pedophile" is elastic enough to include just about anyone they don't like, especially gays, lesbians, and brown people.

I was not aware of this. Could you point me toward where I can find the information that WfI is targeting gays, lebsians, and people of color under the umbrella of child porn and/or pedophilia?

But they are allowing an extremist hate group--a group that wouldn't be allowed to have an LJ community under the current TOS--to dictate their corporate policy and to have a greater say than those of us who are actually paying for their service.Certainly there are things WfI could quote from LJ to advertisers that would make them blanch. That's not the same as WfI metaphorically holding LJ hostage; that's someone with an agenda pointing things out about LJ's existing member community and public posts that are accessible

[revid]

Amen. I completely agree. LJ/6A completely over-reacted, then managed to dig themselves deeper with the mis-management of the situation, but for heaven's sake, it wasn't some evil plot on their part, and they've apologized and tried to make it right.

I went right ahead and got myself a permanent account, just like I had planned to, and I have no problems with doing so.

I don't see anyone's civil rights being infringed upon. And I agree, moving to another journaling site is fine, but there is no guarantee that the same thing won't happen there.

[dragonkal]

I agree with your take on 6A/LJ's errors (and lack thereof). When people sit down to make a journaling system, I'm sure a lot of thought goes into how to handle material they don't want on their site, but they can't possibly think through every possible scenario in advance. (Somehow I doubt there were board meetings about chan and where it fit, or didn't, in the TOS.)

Mostly I just see this as emblematic of how fucked up we are as a country about these issues. If WfI can make LJ change policy by threatening to expose that LJ is allowing lawful but controversial content to be hosted on their sites, that's a symptom of a much, much larger problem than LJ.

[pete23]

+1.

[helsmeta]

The brouhaha has frustrated me since day 1. Fandom seems to want a service that will stand up for their rights like a fellow fan, but which offers the high quality of service and distinct lack of ads associated with a large company. But it's not happy with the service from people who stand up for the rights of posters (JF has come under the gun of people wanting them to close things down more than once), and yet they're not happy with the restrictions placed on them by a strong business.

Until the day there's a company that does both things and does them both well -- and as one of the people who did some rudimentary research into it, I don't know that it's possible -- I think that the sheer inertia of sticking to LJ will make all of this moot. LJ's the service that will have the most up-to-date features, and the one where ads are most circumventable. I find it difficult to believe that 50,000 people will decide to take a voluntary step down in terms of quality of service offered until such a time as the bannings reach critical

[helsmeta]

associated with a large company -- lemme correct that to "specifically associated with LJ", because many many large companies are ALL about the ads.

[dragonkal]

Good point about how money and fandom tend to divulge. Stuff run for fans is awesome, but it just can't provide the same amount of features as something run for profit. And when you run something for profit, a lot of stuff comes into the picture that's at odds with fandom, since fandom is by desire and necessity nonprofit.

[semyaza]

Not entirely in the minority. Thank you for your thoughts both here and in your comments at msilverstar's LJ. They're much appreciated.

[dragonkal]

Thank you. I was really concerned that I was one of maybe three people who feel this way, and the more folks like yourself comment, the happier I am that I decided to speak my piece.