I've just joined a writers' critique group. I don't think it's a great fit for me, but before I go shopping for something different, I thought I'd ask here
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Any group I've ever been a part of has been most helpful in getting me to write so I have something to bring to the group. Often the critique hasn't been too useful, but getting myself to carve out some time regularly to focus on writing is what I need most anyway.
Thanks. Yeah, that was the immediately-obvious benefit of my joining this one. I think I just needed some insights like yours to help me triangulate on what's really valuable in the practice, versus what my expectations were.
Was the Clarion method the coin of the realm in groups you've been in? I have a hard time imagining anything more efficient, but then, I've never seen any other approach in action.
I've never been in a critique group, but very often, really obtuse comments can be helpful, because you have to think about *why* they're obtuse and what you should do other than the unhelpful suggestions they've given.
Good point. It was very helpful to me (though not in the moment) to get a kind of blank look, and my manuscript handed back to me with "I don't really have any comments." Since it was clear that she wasn't saying "This is perfect!!!" I had to step back for a couple of days and really think about my own assumptions. Who's my target audience? How much do I care about that? Am I under "the curse of knowledge" that Steven Pinker devotes a section to in The Sense of Style?
I don't know the answers yet. Meanwhile, in order to get at least some feedback, I tried making my second submission more generally accessible, and behold! It actually did improve the damn thing.
No, I won't. I send my stuff off to a few friends to read over. They are really good at catching the grammatical errors and making sure the plot makes sense, that dialog works, etc. I can always trust them when they say something does not work. But I was way too traumatized by the malicious glee that some of the people in the groups I tried took in ripping my stuff apart to ever participate in a group again. I am too introverted to play well with others, I guess.
That's horrible! I'm sorry it happened to you. I applaud you for continuing to write after those kinds of experience: I know at least one writer who gave up.
Policing other people's creativity is just wrong. I'm glad you've found compatible beta-reader friends.
Thank you for this interesting post. I've never been part of such a group, but I think that I'd probably profit immensely from it, since there are so many basic aspects of writing that I still struggle with.
Looking forward to everyone else's thoughts and experiences!
Hi. Thanks for stopping by. As always when I Ask the Community, I'm getting some really good points back, and they're helping me triangulate on a solid way to think about group-based writing help.
One thing was clear from the start: nobody writes well in complete isolation. Even the greatest prose stylists need an editor. It's not nearly as lonely a profession as the cliche would have us believe!
Off and on, I've been in a few critique groups in my day. In fact, I just joined a virtual critique group that focuses on historical fiction. By and large, I have found it helpful. There's just nothing quite as valuable as getting the opinions of unbiased people. There have been two drawbacks though - 1. It's time consuming because I need to read other people's work too. I'm also rather disorganized so that probably makes it take longer than it should. 2. One member of the group is rather abrasive and stated multiple times that she 'didn't like my story.' And then failed to give suggestions about how I might improve said story. When I asked for them she told me that it would take too much time to give me suggestions. I won't be exchanging critiques with her anymore.
If you think my group might be a better fit for you let me know and I'll request that you can join. It's rather nice not to have to physically go somewhere.
Very tempting! May I hold this offer in reserve while I give my own new group a chance to gel? Historical fiction is, broadly speaking, what I'm working on now (and I'm excited to hear that you are too!). Tell me a little more about it--how many members, what level of critique are they looking for, etc.
Your number 2 drawback is a big one. Wow, how rude! I can't help thinking that the in-person meeting format (though fraught with logistical drawbacks) at least prevents that kind of counterproductive stuff. The peer pressure to behave decently would be too great, I think.
But transit time to my local group is going to become a problem for me before too long, I think, and there's one additional drawback that I didn't harp on here: they insist on working from paper copies. (As the kids say on Tumblr, I can't even. I haven't owned a printer for 15 years and I don't work in an office anymore!) So I'm potentially very interested in your group.
Of course, take all the time you need. There are 13 members of this group, although a few aren't active right now. Most of them seem to write het romance which could have been the problem I had with that one member. My story is romance too but it's quirky and strange and I guess she just didn't know what to do with it. Most members seem to give general critiques, which is good.
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Was the Clarion method the coin of the realm in groups you've been in? I have a hard time imagining anything more efficient, but then, I've never seen any other approach in action.
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I don't know the answers yet. Meanwhile, in order to get at least some feedback, I tried making my second submission more generally accessible, and behold! It actually did improve the damn thing.
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Policing other people's creativity is just wrong. I'm glad you've found compatible beta-reader friends.
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Looking forward to everyone else's thoughts and experiences!
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One thing was clear from the start: nobody writes well in complete isolation. Even the greatest prose stylists need an editor. It's not nearly as lonely a profession as the cliche would have us believe!
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Off and on, I've been in a few critique groups in my day. In fact, I just joined a virtual critique group that focuses on historical fiction. By and large, I have found it helpful. There's just nothing quite as valuable as getting the opinions of unbiased people. There have been two drawbacks though - 1. It's time consuming because I need to read other people's work too. I'm also rather disorganized so that probably makes it take longer than it should. 2. One member of the group is rather abrasive and stated multiple times that she 'didn't like my story.' And then failed to give suggestions about how I might improve said story. When I asked for them she told me that it would take too much time to give me suggestions. I won't be exchanging critiques with her anymore.
If you think my group might be a better fit for you let me know and I'll request that you can join. It's rather nice not to have to physically go somewhere.
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Your number 2 drawback is a big one. Wow, how rude! I can't help thinking that the in-person meeting format (though fraught with logistical drawbacks) at least prevents that kind of counterproductive stuff. The peer pressure to behave decently would be too great, I think.
But transit time to my local group is going to become a problem for me before too long, I think, and there's one additional drawback that I didn't harp on here: they insist on working from paper copies. (As the kids say on Tumblr, I can't even. I haven't owned a printer for 15 years and I don't work in an office anymore!) So I'm potentially very interested in your group.
Thanks!
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LOL paper copies? That is rather archaic!
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