Weird, amirite?

Jul 28, 2010 06:31

So liek, almost no one reading this likely knows what I'm even going on about, but... I was poking around for I can't remember what, and I came across this discussion on the GameFAQs forums about Mana in Atelier Iris 3 ( Read more... )

atelier iris, my eeny weeny gust fandoms

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Comments 9

rubyprism July 28 2010, 13:55:45 UTC
Like I said on IM (and am just adding here for the record, in case any Gust fans are reading your journal), I think it's the alchemy. Iris works with Prima Materia, which, it is said, if you take it lightly, it will destroy you. So perhaps it's not that she so much brings darkness to the table within her own personality, as that she's got the tinge of it hanging around her from dwelling in it as she's had to.

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"My darkness brings all the boys to the yard." --Not!Ansem execharmonious July 28 2010, 13:57:45 UTC
That's true. She's someone who's descended into the darkness, probably multiple times. And she's been ready to give up life, which, while noble and also sensible in the circumstances, is a dark action, maybe.

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"Taking trips to the darkness and coming back alive is different from what Kingdom Hearts claims." rubyprism July 28 2010, 14:03:10 UTC
Yes, I think it is dark-- in that she's turned towards the giving up of life, and said, "Then I'll do this." She's not fighting for life with her last breath; she's made an acknowledgement that she will accept it when it comes, even (in the case of your Iris) embrace it, and that's dark. It's not bad-- just dark.

I think if there's any confusion floating around, it's this vestigial "but doing the heroic and noble thing isn't dark, right?" thing that we have left over from impressions that darkness, being frightening, must be evil. But in this case, darkness just happened to be the heroic and noble thing. 'cause sometimes it is. And that, perhaps, is the theme of AI3 as we see it, anyway.

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execharmonious July 28 2010, 14:09:09 UTC
Yeah, when you put it like that... that makes a lot of sense, and I like that analysis. Sometimes the heroic and noble thing is dark. And I think I can play with this.

I mean, I also think it's way too subtle for GUST to have thought of - the idea of doing a Dark things that's also Good but makes you less Pure - but I like it.

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elhermano August 3 2010, 02:05:19 UTC
Now I'm thinking about this. Before, I'd just chalked it up to Iris being the "Yin" and "occult" character to Edge's (and for that matter Nell's) yang. I'd also chalked Edge being "pure of heart" up to being an intentional undermining of Edge's attempts to be grumpy and anti-hero, to sort of make fun of him for being so serious. He acts tough, but inside he's a softy.

I definitely like the idea of Iris being less pure because she's stained her fingers playing with the dye, so to speak, but I also agree that I don't give GUST that much credit.

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execharmonious August 3 2010, 02:10:18 UTC
Yeah. I wish I could feel like I could give them credit for it, but despite that they do like to explore these concepts, their renderings of them aren't usually that subtle.

Hm, I suppose you could pin Iris as the Yin of the party. She's definitely more internally focused - she has to be. She's not about putting out so much light and sound and fury, but about subtler ways to get things done. Her waters run deeper, and perhaps more still.

It still surprised me when I went back to replay the game that she wasn't the main (controllable) character. I had always had it in my head that she was. The game really doesn't strike me as Edge's story.

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laryna6 February 5 2011, 08:53:24 UTC
I tend to think that is because Edge is whipped. Like, they wanted to make a game with a more RPG-y male protagonist for mass appeal, but then they put him in with Iris, who just completely walked all over him.

He fits the Decoy Protagonist trope, really: the everyman character who is there as a spectator in Iris' story, a viewpoint character for the player.

It's clear that they intended at some point to have there be this big rivalry between Edge and Ash and so on, but nope, denied. True, there's the sense that Edge is pretty ticked off at Ash, especially for attacking Iris and so on, but he never does anything about it because Iris and her life are more important, obviously.

On second playthrough, it really just became obvious to me that Edge = doormat. He'd like to take a stand and tell Iris that he doesn't really want to hear about alchemy (which would be much nicer than the passive-agressive dismissing it), but he's just too much of a doormat.

Regarding Rufina, the question when someone says 'pure of heart' is pure what? ( ... )

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execharmonious February 6 2011, 02:23:42 UTC
Friend away! I'll be happy to friend back. Sorry my life has been eaten.

And this is an interesting perspective. I'd never thought of Edge as blindly selfless, but the more I think on it, it's true. He's an Annoying Love Interest with no motivations or appeal beyond that, which is what makes it all the more infuriating that he's the protagonist. It's not his story. He doesn't really have much of a story.

So yeah, I can see him as kind of stripped of much self-concern to the point where he'd be on a similar wavelength with someone whose purpose is to do good acts and not really have a sense of self. Although... the particular manifestation of it in Edge is one that never comes off to me as useful in the way that angelic selflessness might be useful, in the sense that he seems like the kind of person who'll do things for others because he believes that's what's Right, without checking in that that's what would really be useful to them. Which is not a terribly good thing to be espousing as "pure" without any criticism....

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