S3 Discussion Post

[shadowedkit]

Hi guys

Comments

Finn/Santana discussion thread.

[gammods]

In response to recent events on discussion and prompt posts, we've decided to open this discussion thread specifically to talk about the conflicts between Santana and Finn. The tension, anger and conflict has been building between these two characters for three seasons, and has spilled over into the fandom, causing angry fights between fans

Re: Finn/Santana discussion thread.

[fearfullt]

My opinion on the whole issue is that Santana deserves consequences. That said, it's never the right thing to out someone who isn't ready to out themselves. In that respect, Finn was wrong. But I don't think he was coming from a malicious place - yes he wanted to say something to hurt her, but he was only lashing out with the most hurtful thing he could think of because she had been verbally eviscerating him (and bullying his friends) for a long time before that

Re: Finn/Santana discussion thread.

[gammods]

Well, to me they're both wrong and although Finn tried to hurt her I kinda understand why he did it. I mean, Santana always hurts other people and nobody stops her and Finn was hurt and desperate BUT the way he did it was wrong. He should have used her sexuality as a weapon BUT Santana is not an innocent angel so I can't hate Finn.

Actually, I don't hate either. I just wish they would realize they were wrong and Santana seriously need help not only to accept her sexuality and with her family but she has other issues too.

Re: Finn/Santana discussion thread, 3.07 spoilers

[gammods]

For me, the issue isn't what was said necessarily, but who said, where, and for what purpose. Santana absolutely needed to be faced with the repercussions of her attitude, but Finn was not the one who should have done it. It's like with Will screaming at Quinn. Quinn has some serious issues and needs someone who cares about her to tell her that her actions are petty and insane and get her help, but Will is the last person who should be acting morally superior to her and screaming at his fucked up student was inappropriate. Similarly, Santana needed someone who cared about her to tell her to cut the shit. I could see Brittany or Mercedes filling that role much better

Re: Finn/Santana discussion thread, 3.07 spoilers

[gammods]

My problem with Finn is that he's wrapped up in so many layers of privilege he doesn't understand how hurtful his assumptions and actions can be. Yes, Santana is hurtful, but she knows that what she's doing is hurtful, and is doing it intentionally to keep people at arm's length. She's going to have to face her consequences eventually, and she knows that. But Finn is mostly ignorant of how hurtful he is, which makes him more dangerous.

Re: Finn/Santana discussion thread, 3.07 spoilers

[gammods]

My problem with Santana is she's fully aware of what she's doing and just doesn't care. She doesn't care that she hurts people, she has no sympathy for them, and she gets pleasure out of their suffering. She doesn't do it to keep people at an arm's length. She enjoys their pain. She's the most dangerous kind of person because of her lack of caring. She passed on a disease that is still potentially fatal, even if it's rarely, on purpose just to see people suffer. And she didn't give a care, she enjoyed every second of it and even poked at their suffering even more. That goes way beyond being a dangerous bully.

Re: Finn/Santana discussion thread, 3.07 spoilers

[gammods]

Yes, but even criminals are entitled to certain rights.

I don't care how badly somebody is abused, that doesn't give you a free pass to abuse people back. Yes, Santana deserves consequences for her actions. But so does Finn.

In tonight's episode Finn is going to blackmail Santana into coming back to ND, and then perform a condescending "Girl Power" song, that makes me want to hit him.

Finn and Santana both need attitude adjusments. Santana needs to own up to her shot and realize everything she's done wrong. And Finn needs to wake up to his privilege and internalized homophobia, as well as his condescension.

As somebody said upthread, both are victims and both are villains.

Re: Finn/Santana discussion thread, 3.07 spoilers

[gammods]

In tonight's episode everyone that Santana has tormented for the past 2 and a half years is going to rally and support her and sing to her. The girls are all singing I Kissed A Girl, which is a far more offensive song. And Santana, still bullies, still abuses, she condescends too and she slams people's sexuality too. She needs to her priviledge too because she's been a Cheerio and protected by Sue for most of high school. She's never faced the bullying the others have, she's been the cause of it. We're getting someone trying to make up and set things right, and someone who still doesn't care that she's a bully.

Re: Finn/Santana discussion thread, 3.07 spoilers

[lm_mage]

Maybe we should hold off on judging Finn and Santana's new actions until we actually see them? For now why don't we hold to what's actually aired?

Re: Finn/Santana discussion thread, 3.07 spoilers

[lm_mage]

There is really only one reason I can't get behind this line of thinking

Re: Finn/Santana discussion thread, 3.07 spoilers

[gammods]

There is a big difference between what Finn did to Santana and Santana did to Karofsky. First and foremost, you will notice that Karofsky is still in the closet. Santana threatened to out him, but she did not not actually do so, and it is very different from Finn who actually outed her. Beyond that, there was not a power imbalance with her and Karofsky. The first thing Santana did was tell Karofsky that she was also in the closet, giving him as much power over her as she had over him, making the blackmail essentially useless. Santana did not have a secret of Finn's that she could reveal that would have equal repercussions. Finally, what Finn did he did out of spite. He did what he did fully intending to hurt Santana in the worst way he could. Santana "blackmailed" Karofsky into a situation that was mutually beneficial to both of them, and the fact that she revealed her own weakness means that the true elements of blackmail were removed. So equating the two and using it to excuse Finn's actions, even minimally, is somewhat flawed.

Re: Finn/Santana discussion thread.

[gammods]

My stance on Santana hasn't changed a bit and I don't feel any sympathy for her. She reduces everyone to their insecurities and doesn't give a care about the consequences of her actions, then she tries to justifies her tormenting by saying things like it's hilarious and she's just keeping it real. She doesn't get to put herself higher than everyone else and act like she's more important than them. She treats everyone like they're no better than dirt under her shoes then runs off crying when she's called out on it. She didn't give a second thought to outing all the secrets she's outed or a second thought to anything she does. She only cares about herself

[wanderinghope]

Re: Finn/Santana discussion thread.

[fearfullt]

In a perfect world this comment above would not have needed to be anon. You've pretty much said exactly what I feel about Santana and her actions up to 3x06 (yet to see newest episode at time of posting)... Only I'm normally far too scared of being yelled at by strangers to admit to it.

Re: Finn/Santana discussion thread.

[gammods]

I'm pretty disgusted by people saying that Santana deserved to be outed.

Yeah, Santana's been pretty awful to Finn lately, but she didn't deserve that. Karofsky did worse to Kurt last season, and he didn't out him.

Speaking of Kurt and last season, you'd think Finn would remember that his stepbrother was bullied out of school by a homophobe (yeah, there were more issues with the Karofsky thing, but Finn doesn't know that) who threatened to kill him and maybe try to be a bit more cautious with his words.

Finally, am I the only one concerned about Brittany here? Nothing he said actually implicated Brittany as being non-heterosexual, but he gave more than enough information for the student body to jump to conclusions about her as well. However bad Santana may have been, Brittany sure as hell did not deserve to be outed.