Regarding the Orlando Attacks ...

[jordan179]

What you're seeing here is the Caliphate attempting to enforce its laws -- shari'a -- in Western societies by means of terrorist attack.  This is part of a wave of terrorism they explicitly called for, to be launched during Ramadan.  And in shari'a, homosexuality is punishable by death.

This target was cleverly-chosen, because the point is to get

Comments

[robby]

“Hillary will bring hundreds of thousands of refugees, many of whom have hostile beliefs about people of different faiths and values, and some of whom absolutely and openly support terrorism in our country. We don’t need that. We have enough problems.” -Donald Trump

I saw a report of a poll taken by the Al Jazeera Arabic website, (since hidden) that indicates a staggering percentage (~25%) of Muslims in the US support violent Jihad.

[jordan179]

And note that there is an important difference between someone who belives that using violence to spread his faith is morally wrong (most Christians) and someone who believes that it is too dangerous to risk (an at least large minority, and possibly a majority, of Muslims). The reason why Muslims generally don't act to expose the terrorists among them is that they don't think the terrorist are morally wrong; simply reckless. That latter calculation can change as their cause grows stronger.

[tagryn]

I found the AJ poll being referenced, the one going around as saying that "81% of Muslims support ISIS." Looks like was strictly online with no controls as to who was allowed to participate or for representation. In other words, GIGO.

[prester_scott]

This target was cleverly-chosen, because the point is to get some Westerners who hate homosexuals, to sympathize with the motives of the attackers.

Rubbish statement in an otherwise decent post. Devout Muslims are not looking for allies among non-Muslims.

Per sharia, every American is under sentence of death for supporting (by taxes, etc.) an army that has invaded Muslim lands. That makes us all legitimate targets of jihad.

Per sharia, every American is under sentence of death for being an infidel: we have already been invited to accept Islam (through the steady stream of broadcasts from Qaeda, ISIS et al.), so those who continue in some religion or belief system other than Islam, are guilty.

That's two death sentences right out of the gate. Homosexuality incurs a third.

Why would they care about what the twice-condemned think of the thrice-condemned?

[headnoises]

Tactics. Power. Makes us serve them.

[prester_scott]

Yeah, I get it, but I'm saying they don't think that way.

And if I'm wrong, then they miscalculated badly, because the number of non-Muslim Americans who would applaud a slaughter in a gay club, and say, "Y'know, those ISIS guys are OK after all," is a pretty small and politically powerless number.

[headnoises]

Oh goodness yes they miscalculated-- these are the same idiots who don't grok restraint.

[little_e_]

It's an act of war, and I'm fucking pissed, and I'm also fucking pissed that most of the people I interact with are either "sad" about it and "sending their condolences to Orlando" or acting like nothing has happened at all, instead of outraged.

I'm also pissed at my gay acquaintances who accused me of "racism" for pointing out that Muslim immigration is a bad thing for them and who claimed that "moderate Muslims are fine with gays." Even if they were (which they aren't, as anyone who actually pays attention to what Muslims believe knows,) it only takes a small minority who think its a good idea to murder gays to make things really unpleasant.

Ignorance is not virtue.

You can have Muslims or gays, but you can't have both.

[marycatelli]

The ones I've run across parade some gay Muslims. That is, the very fringe of the fringe. . . .

[sianmink]

I wonder what the violent death and suicide rate is among openly gay muslims.

I'm guessing it's alarmingly high.

[robby]

The latest is that the killer was known at the club, and had messaged some of the men frequently.

[justgoto]

I agree. I am responsible for my own security.

[scottks]

be prepared to fight for it

It doesn't take that many people to overwhelm a single shooter. Sounds like nobody wanted to pull a Todd Beamer. "Let's Roll" should be the rally cry of anyone stuck in this situation. Easy to say but hard to do. But in a crowded, dark nightclub, I find it odd that there were no former football players who knew how to tackle. You can die trying to stop the shooter, or just die.
http://www.history.com/topics/9-11-attacks/videos/the-todd-beamer-story-lets-roll

[headnoises]

From what I've read, anybody with the kind of sense to do that was busy trying to get people out-- there was a separated Marine, Afghanistan vet, who was a bouncer; he had to stop people from doing the crowd-crush at the back door because they couldn't figure out how to unlatch it.
In the dark, when you're scared and there's a hallway full of people pushing on you, that's a lot harder than it sounds. Especially if most people had been drinking.
***
Seriously, what would it take to offer free firearm training to bartenders? They're going to be sober, they're not melee range, and it would be relatively easy to turn a bar from concealment to cover.

[sianmink]

That had to be it, anyone with the sense to group people up to fight a single attacker intent on killing everyone had already found a better exit than a bathroom with no exits.