LJ confessional

[juldea]

Somewhat tangentially to what I think of as my social circle are the people who actively participate in the "LJ Confessional," which is just a post made about once a year, open to anonymous comments, for people to let loose whatever's on their mind. swashbucklr is I think the closest of my friends to that group, and his post announcing the opening of

Comments

[londo]

I'd just want to make a comment threatening to have hot boysex with zombie_dog again.

[juldea]

I hate you in that loving way.

[londo]

<3

[laura47]

live in my house, I'll be your shelter, just pay me back with one thousand kisses...

[siderea]

Huh. The thing that came up in the negative feedback? You've never done it (in my recollection) in conversation with me... but you in fact do it in your reply. The feedback was that you make the "assumption that the other person just doesn't get it", and in reply you... make the assumption that the other person just doesn't get it, and explain that "in fact" something else is going on. But what you then go on to explain is this different reality ("my worry that I am explaining myself poorly") is exactly what the other person said was the problem in the first place, not something different at all

[juldea]

Argh. Trying to avoid doing this thing in my reply to you is pretty much leaving me unable to respond at all. Is it just so inherent in my conversation/debate style that I don't know how to talk otherwise? Am I misunderstanding the problem on a higher level? It feels like I can't even come back at this point with a clarification without that being "you don't get it." Isn't that what a clarification actually is? I don't think it's possible for me to engage a debate without the ability to clarify my statements.

[siderea]

This reply is heroic and awesome, just so's you know. :) You're exactly right that it's like you don't know how to talk otherwise. It's a habit, and habits are hard to break. It feels like AUGH WHAT ELSE COULD I POSSIBLY DO?! Also, with a heaping side of, AUGH THIS IS LIKE SAYING ALL THOSE AWFUL PEOPLE IN THE PAST WERE RIGHT

[alexx_kay]

"When someone says, "this thing you're doing, I don't like it", one has the choice of debating it, but it's not the only choice."

Some other choices, appropriate in some circumstances:

* I acknowledge that I do, in fact, do this thing.
* I value your opinion enough to attempt to change this behavior.
* I value doing this thing too much to change it just because you don't like it.

Note the clear distinction between the issue of whether the other person is factually correct, and the issue of whether you share their value judgments about the matter under discussion.

I generally have found it useful to debate matters of fact until agreement is reached. Contrariwise, I have found it it useful to *discuss* matters of values until *understanding* is reached; after that point, if you don't agree, going further rarely accomplishes anything.

[aroraborealis]

Nice work on inviting comments and responding to the ones you've gotten so far. Thanks for helping to keep the bar high!

[juldea]

Aw, thank you! And thank you for doing the Confessional. I find it fascinating!

[swashbucklr]

To be honest, I'm kind of tangential to what I assume to be "that crowd" myself. There are a few people who regularly post to the Confessional that I recognize, but others I don't.

But I do enjoy the Confessional. It's been fun this year.