I did not trust prop 8 would "have no chance". I donated money to this cause. I gave of my time and efforts to this cause. I supplied my neighborhood with "no on 8" yard signs when theirs were stolen or official signs were not to be found.
And if any of my daughters wants to marry another woman someday and raise a family (my kids both want kids some day!), she gods damned well deserves that RIGHT.
You are better then most, Myself I knew of Prop 8 for months, but I did not hear much about it in the news. Then September rolled around and the Prop8 group took off with every dirty underhanded and ignorant argument you could think of.
But there was no response, rational mind did not get out there and when we did it was fractured and uncoordinated. We must never again allow this to happen.
Win or lose tonight I honestly think it's just a matter of time. We will go back and forth on this issue here and in the rest of the states with propositions, legal challenges and court decisions but eventually the country will move forward as other countries already have.
Would this have been as close a vote in 1998? Or 1988? In 1978 Proposition 6 was seen as a sure thing and Stonewall was less than ten years before that. It's two steps forward and one back, I think.
Which still doesn't make the process any more fun.
You can't change the way people think about anything if you refused to talk too them, it just does not work.
But some ppl don't want to hear. I've had far too many pointless discussions/arguments w/ppl whose weren't going to change (incld. family members, unfortunately; not the ones in this state tho). It's a fine line, but some ppl you do just have to drop & move on.
You can't convince everyone, but my point is that you can't convince anyone if you refuse to talk to them and nothing will happen that did not happen tonight.
I talked many people into dropping their support of 8 by talking about things in terms they can empathize with. Now I am good at this, it is a skill, I recognize it and fully admit that you can't teach it to others.
What we need to do now is start a new ballot initiative to repeal 8, it needs to be grass roots and it needs to bring Californians together. We need to capture the narrative, we need to speak to people in terms they understand and agree with. To Christians you need to speak in term of the message of love. To libertarians you need to speak in terms of government overstepping, to minorities you need to speak in terms of basic civil rights.
We need to show that married gay families are just the same as every other family. We need to replace the images of the gay pride parade in peoples minds and replace it
( ... )
I meant finding the line between which ppl's minds can be changed & which ones can't is fine. It's the folks who are clearly unchanging that just have to be dropped, & there are a few of those I'm discovering today. Their loss, imo.
But the court case is already starting against 8. I rather hate our initiative system; it's mob rule, & you just can't reason with that.
Comments 6
I donated money to this cause.
I gave of my time and efforts to this cause.
I supplied my neighborhood with "no on 8" yard signs when theirs were stolen or official signs were not to be found.
And if any of my daughters wants to marry another woman someday and raise a family (my kids both want kids some day!), she gods damned well deserves that RIGHT.
Reply
But there was no response, rational mind did not get out there and when we did it was fractured and uncoordinated. We must never again allow this to happen.
That is the point I was making.
Reply
Would this have been as close a vote in 1998? Or 1988? In 1978 Proposition 6 was seen as a sure thing and Stonewall was less than ten years before that. It's two steps forward and one back, I think.
Which still doesn't make the process any more fun.
Reply
But some ppl don't want to hear. I've had far too many pointless discussions/arguments w/ppl whose weren't going to change (incld. family members, unfortunately; not the ones in this state tho). It's a fine line, but some ppl you do just have to drop & move on.
Reply
You can't convince everyone, but my point is that you can't convince anyone if you refuse to talk to them and nothing will happen that did not happen tonight.
I talked many people into dropping their support of 8 by talking about things in terms they can empathize with. Now I am good at this, it is a skill, I recognize it and fully admit that you can't teach it to others.
What we need to do now is start a new ballot initiative to repeal 8, it needs to be grass roots and it needs to bring Californians together. We need to capture the narrative, we need to speak to people in terms they understand and agree with. To Christians you need to speak in term of the message of love. To libertarians you need to speak in terms of government overstepping, to minorities you need to speak in terms of basic civil rights.
We need to show that married gay families are just the same as every other family. We need to replace the images of the gay pride parade in peoples minds and replace it ( ... )
Reply
But the court case is already starting against 8. I rather hate our initiative system; it's mob rule, & you just can't reason with that.
Reply
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