I hope she's on witch time out. It was still awful what he did but I hope that we get a glimpse of WHY he would do such a thing or we learn that he's actually been doing such things to witches for years. Bonnie's family, the wild geese, have gone South for the winter - perhaps they'll appear next season for five minutes and promptly die for their trouble. But seriously, she needs someone, we need Lucy.
Seeing it happen with Caroline was awful. But this situation almost feels worse to me because the show's not even really trying to humanize the situation or to let Andie be a human. It can feel like we're supposed to look at this situation and maybe laugh, oh how funny, Andie said something and Damon told her to shut it - or, oh, look, Andie's a journalist and Damon literally patted her on the head because she's so smart! I don't know, it's awful. Blech.
It is awful what he did to her, but in the same right it was awful what she did to Luka. I think I know why he did it.
We still haven't met Bonnie's father. WTF is that about?
I don't understand why we have to go through this again. It's bad story telling and it's sickening, this treatment of this character who is solely there to be Damon's cute witless sex puppet.
Hahaha, yup, me too - I couldn't believe he was saying something like that but you know this since I tweeted you at the time. It would be so brilliant if Bonnie could call on the power of her ancestors to reclaim her powers, oh wow, even if it doesn't happen on the show, I need me some fic of those witches that came to MF way back when (seriously considering doing the TVD Big Bang for this show there is so much material to work with, material the writers continually discard in favor of stuff I often don't find compelling - again you know this since we are twins
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It's so funny how people were so quick to literally point that out: Bonnie 'mind-raped' Luka, which that metaphorical terminology is sort of problematic for me, and I use it too and can't decide if I'm trying to soften things by trying to figure out a different way to say it, like she violated his mind or physically assaulted him or magically assaulted him. Anyway, back to the point, ACTUALLY calling out Damon for what he has certainly done in the past and what he's doing now is a big, fat no. Oh, fandoms world over, please change.
I'm not mad at Jonas. I'm calling that a witch's timeout because what Bonnie did last week was bootleg. Talk about mindraping someone--that's exactly what she did to Luka and then lied to him about it at the beginning of the episode. She cared not one whit that she violated Luka. Jonas warned her, so did Luka. Luka BEGGED her not to continue, but she didn't listen. I don't think it's permanent, and I'm believing Jonas until I'm shown otherwise that the stripping is for her own good. Bonnie is wading into waters for which she's unprepared and she's not thinking clearly; maybe this is the wake up call she needs.
Oh, I definitely agree with you. But I'm mad at Jonas. In the same way that I was angry with Bonnie last week even while I was impressed for her doing what she thought it took. Both situations are just terrible. I think what's interesting is this feels like a tacit acknowledgment by the show of Bonnie's wrongdoing last week, even though I did feel it was awful. She pays for her bad choices - really she pays for many of her choices. Would that the show would do the same for some other characters.
I think Bonnie is wading into dangerous waters too and she clearly needs training and guidance but tbh, I don't think that makes Jonas stripping her of her powers without her consent and informing her that it's for 'her own good' okay or anything. I like how complicated all their motivations are, and I'm also a little ooked by it. But these characters wouldn't be interestingly flawed and the show would have no story if they took the path of least resistance or made decisions that respected each other's humanity and autonomy.
Oh, I wasn't happy with it, but I'm not mad with what Jonas did. I guess I liken it to a "witch whoopin'"--my mama would warn me and I wouldn't listen and then I got a butt cut. My mama never asked for my "consent" for that stuff, either! lol Granted, this is an extreme example of such, but this is not a game; and if that's what it takes to impress that upon Bonnie, then I guess it's what it takes. And no, Jonas isn't her daddy, but I defy someone to tell me Shelia probably wouldn't break her foot up Bonnie's ass for doing that to Luka if she were around. Hell...Bonnie probably wouldn't have done that if Shelia were around, RiP. Jonas said they were all a family, and while they may have had ulterior motives to get close to Bonnie, I don't think they were lying, either. They have no loyalties to Elena, so I understand why they wouldn't think twice about seeing her dead; but they do/did have a loyalty to Bonnie, and she shat all up on that (understandably so, because they're just some dudes and Elena's her BFF)--which is ironic,
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I love that link you drew there with Sheila stating she would protect hers. Grams would not stand for Luka being tortured like that, especially to protect vampires and a doppelganger, even if it was Elena? I miss her so much, damn you, show.
I'm desperate to believe that the witches have a mentality similar to the wolves, in that they protect their own, the greater witch community. Ooooh, I like the idea of Jonas collecting them but for some reason when I watched that scene the first time, it came off as slightly, only slightly sinister or like the show was secretly winking at me. But that might be the show actually winking at me and Jonas has been collecting the grimoires and essentially reclaiming all that stolen knowledge from Klaus. I like that much better.
Fingers crossed that they really let this story play out because I'm so intrigued by everything Jonas-Luka-Bonnie-witches right now.
LOL, yeah, it's hard to pick sides, I'll always have Bonnie, Caro and Elena's backs I think but it's great that they're also really flawed as characters. The show doesn't really let us sit there and think, oh, they're perfect for the most part so I can work with that.
Cultural and historical appropriation explicitly referred to on this show when we've been getting sly references of it from the very start but I figured they were too chicken shit to confront it openly? I love it.
YUP. I think they totally went there. I think they were ~going there~ all over this episode, actually, and confronting a lot of paternalistic attitudes that Alaric/Damon/Stefan are holding and I loved that shit too.
It was nice to see Elijah begging and seriously ruffled, possibly the first time we've seen that happen. I also like that she was the one to kill Elijah.
MOST BADASS SCENE EVER. Elena Gilbert, you have come so far.
8. Also, I didn't realize how much I cared about Jenna until I saw her nearly break in the face of all these lies. She doesn't deserve this and these people are stupid. I love her for walking away and not just trying to smooth things over or pretend like it's not happening.RIGHT? Someone on my flist suggested they need a Facebook group where they can all discuss things like "clueing Jenna in"
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Yes, yes, yes to the paternalistic attitude of these lads, I love how we had Jenna and Elena confront that and it breaks my heart that we have someone like Andie, who is the victim of every misogynistic anything and she can't really even fight - for herself even. Even that's been taken from her.
Elena Gilbert is badass.
LOLOLOL, oh Uncle John, would that he had succeeded.
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Seeing it happen with Caroline was awful. But this situation almost feels worse to me because the show's not even really trying to humanize the situation or to let Andie be a human. It can feel like we're supposed to look at this situation and maybe laugh, oh how funny, Andie said something and Damon told her to shut it - or, oh, look, Andie's a journalist and Damon literally patted her on the head because she's so smart! I don't know, it's awful. Blech.
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We still haven't met Bonnie's father. WTF is that about?
I don't understand why we have to go through this again. It's bad story telling and it's sickening, this treatment of this character who is solely there to be Damon's cute witless sex puppet.
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I will not be brought down!
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DUDE ME TOO! I fells so hard for Elijah and did a fist pump when he said those things. I'm glad they hinting at it, but gosh I want them to go there!
It would be so kill if Bonnie/Luka/Jonas killed Klaus. Fandom would lose it's mind, but I wouldn't curr.
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It's so funny how people were so quick to literally point that out: Bonnie 'mind-raped' Luka, which that metaphorical terminology is sort of problematic for me, and I use it too and can't decide if I'm trying to soften things by trying to figure out a different way to say it, like she violated his mind or physically assaulted him or magically assaulted him. Anyway, back to the point, ACTUALLY calling out Damon for what he has certainly done in the past and what he's doing now is a big, fat no. Oh, fandoms world over, please change.
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I think Bonnie is wading into dangerous waters too and she clearly needs training and guidance but tbh, I don't think that makes Jonas stripping her of her powers without her consent and informing her that it's for 'her own good' okay or anything. I like how complicated all their motivations are, and I'm also a little ooked by it. But these characters wouldn't be interestingly flawed and the show would have no story if they took the path of least resistance or made decisions that respected each other's humanity and autonomy.
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I love that link you drew there with Sheila stating she would protect hers. Grams would not stand for Luka being tortured like that, especially to protect vampires and a doppelganger, even if it was Elena? I miss her so much, damn you, show.
I'm desperate to believe that the witches have a mentality similar to the wolves, in that they protect their own, the greater witch community. Ooooh, I like the idea of Jonas collecting them but for some reason when I watched that scene the first time, it came off as slightly, only slightly sinister or like the show was secretly winking at me. But that might be the show actually winking at me and Jonas has been collecting the grimoires and essentially reclaiming all that stolen knowledge from Klaus. I like that much better.
Fingers crossed that they really let this story play out because I'm so intrigued by everything Jonas-Luka-Bonnie-witches right now.
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I'm magalimoo!
LOL, yeah, it's hard to pick sides, I'll always have Bonnie, Caro and Elena's backs I think but it's great that they're also really flawed as characters. The show doesn't really let us sit there and think, oh, they're perfect for the most part so I can work with that.
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YUP. I think they totally went there. I think they were ~going there~ all over this episode, actually, and confronting a lot of paternalistic attitudes that Alaric/Damon/Stefan are holding and I loved that shit too.
It was nice to see Elijah begging and seriously ruffled, possibly the first time we've seen that happen. I also like that she was the one to kill Elijah.
MOST BADASS SCENE EVER. Elena Gilbert, you have come so far.
8. Also, I didn't realize how much I cared about Jenna until I saw her nearly break in the face of all these lies. She doesn't deserve this and these people are stupid. I love her for walking away and not just trying to smooth things over or pretend like it's not happening.RIGHT? Someone on my flist suggested they need a Facebook group where they can all discuss things like "clueing Jenna in" ( ... )
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Elena Gilbert is badass.
LOLOLOL, oh Uncle John, would that he had succeeded.
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