Meta Post: Magneto and Professor X
I know I get the raised eyebrow of shock ‘cross the Intertubes when this comes up.
I suppose I could add my own meta to this.
But I really can’t see any version of them where they weren’t, at least, in love with each other. Perhaps not a couple, but in love - in fact, ‘in love’ but never acted upon makes a LOT of sense in some canons.
But I’m aware too often people (-uh hem- young people) forget there are many types of love. I mean, there is Agápe, Éros, and Philaand ALL of them mean love - just different types. The question I’ve always had was WHAT type applied to them.
I’ve seen a real (shocking and sickening) devolution in how friendships, specifically between men, are portrayed and excepted to be. I’ve seen is said - and agree - that men are almost taught to be homophobic because men cannot have deep, meaningful, intimate relationships with other men - unless they are lovers. And this has been a fairly recent occurrence. What really cemented that SOMETHING was going on was seeing scans from ‘ At Ease’ - which everyone should read. Has some STUNNING pictures let me tell you. (And Sean buddy? Buddy? Pal? Secret telepathic lover? Friend o’mine? I promise to share scans when I get it.) ANYWAY. The book shows a lot of WWII photographs of young men within Magneto’s same generation. Most older than him, obviously, but only by a handful of years.
The casualness and body language shown between men who weren’t taught to fear affection and touch from other men, even when being nude, didn’t always MATCH the body language shown in the comics between Mags and Chuck. It was friendly, yes, but there were…edges there. Some rough, hurty, painful - these two have done some serious SHIT to each other, and betrayed each other on levels most people would consider unforgivable. Mags isn’t one to consider betray forgivable. And yet, what Charles did as far as attempting to mindwipe him was just THAT. Everything he IS, Charles tried to ease. That’s worse than trying to murder him. No one ALIVE remembers his beloved Anya. His family. Isabelle. Everything he’s seen - he’s borne witness to so much. And so many dead. Some of these people only have names BECAUSE he remembers them. And Charles tried to take that away. There is only person who has ever betrayed him on such a deep level and he’s not turned on. His wife. (Magda and that whole mess is a WHOLE other meta post I won’t subject people to. Promise. Ok, maybe, FOR NOW. DAMMIT BRAIN Now I’m wanting to do monthly meta posts on my headcanon FUUUUUUUUUUUUUCK. A. DUCK, BRAIN WHY YOU DO THIS?!.) So what do I draw from this? The people Mags loves are dear to him, we know this. And certainly, Mags has some intimacy issues. Anyone with the degree of controlling behavior he displays will. And ignoring what happened on Magda’s end - be it ignorance, spite/fear, mental illness - I’ve seen all those theories - on why she abandoned him in the first place (’Cause that’s not the POINT right now, and as I said, a whole other meta post. Which. I. Will. NOT. Do. Right. Now.) looking at it from Mags’ end, it’s the ONE single action he refers back to as proof that humans cannot, will not, ever be able to accept mutants. After everything that he suffered, that nearly destroyed him.
Magneto’s identity has always been important for him. Names, not so much. His name has changed, a lot. If someone were to shout “Max!” in a crowded room, it wouldn’t dawn on him to look around. It someone shouted “Eisenhardt!” it might startle him, but he wouldn’t think HE was being addressed. “Erik”, yes, he would respond. “Magnus”? Ditto. Perhaps - given how recently he’s used it - “Michael” - but more than likely, he’d only respond in if there weren’t that many people to be addressed or if he’d recently used the alias. Ditto with “Xavier”. But for this ONE woman, he was willing to deny everything he was, to find her. To be with her. He could never have been a practicing Jew so long as they lived with the Roma - not that he was. But he couldn’t have even been a secular one - which he is. He would have had to have adopted them as his own people or not have been accepted. And given the reluctance we see Magda showing in moving away from her people - and the areas she ran to when she left him - it’s clear she wasn’t comfortable not being with her people. And while the Camps weren’t just set up for Jews, the ‘Final Solution’ was. In giving up his Jewish identity, Mags was giving up a huge core of who he was, of the forces that shaped him. It’s not surprise to me at all that after he accepted she was gone, he felt the need to ‘find himself’ and fled to Israel. But what she did - whatever the reason - was a huge betrayal. He’d risked so much for her - abuse from schoolmates as children, his family’s (his FATHER’S) disapproval. His life when he was protecting her in the camps. His life after - when he’s shown having to carry her at times when they escaped. His life again, when their home was on fire. And she LEFT him. Everything he’d done, everything he’d given up, all the love he felt for her - and in one instant, one single, solitary instant, she threw it all away. As if it meant nothing. That’s one helluva huge slap in the face folks. And yet - he still loves her. Some of it, certainly, has to do with him loving the idea of her, what she represented (normalcy, a family, hope, peace, love, acceptance) and him having a certain amount of youthful - dare I say, innocent? - blinders on when it comes to her. But the fact is, he’s forgiven her the hurt she caused. (Now…if she showed up alive? Prolly a different story!) And he still loves her.
When Xavier attempted that mindwipe, he wasn’t asking (as Magda was) for Mags to give up his identity - he tried to take it away. That’s a violent, horrible act. It’s been called in some circles telepathic rape - an utter violation of the core of Magneto. And it was. Of all the things Xavier has done - and he’s done a fair amount - that one is pretty unforgivable in my book. He doesn’t even have the “I meant well!” good intentions behind it - not that that would make it any better. And yet…Mags - who really doesn’t know how to forgive, who holds grudges for years, who cannot ever let go of the past, who STILL is angry with Moria MacTagget for “manipulating” his DNA, even if he is mostly over the hostility - forgave Xavier. And is still friendly with him. Still trusts him.
Wait. WHAT?
And what did Mags do? Attacked the one member of Xavier’s team who he KNEW would heal what he was going to do, but knew it would hurt Xavier terribly. Really, most of their fights read a great deal like domestic fights that have gotten frighteningly out of hand. They read, quite often, like a couple trapped in a perpetual cycle of together/break-up/hate/forgive/together. That one couple in every neighborhood, that have gotten together, broken up, gotten back together, broken back up, repeat ad nauseam.
Am I serious? Certainly! Add that in with other things.
Mags has friends - and can carry on friendships, even if they are superficial or end badly - but these are all women. The man really isn’t able to maintain a deep, lasting friendship. There is an exception to both of these - Xavier. Look through his history, and there is only Xavier as the one, not only constant, but only man in Mags’ life who is treated at all as an equal.
Who is the person Xavier calls on when he needs someone he knows will remain (possibly stupidly) loyal to him? Magneto. And let’s face it - Xavier isn’t a saint. Mags has betrayed him a lot. Left him a lot. Put the people he loves - or should love - most in extreme danger, if not tried or threatened to kill. Why would he forgive and be willing to move passed it? In Excalibur, Mags questions him on attempting to save someone, and Xavier points out how many times he’s been asked that about Wolverine. ‘Dreamer,’ Mags replies. ‘Or you,’ Xavier says. ‘Idealist then.’ But there’s humor to it. (Yes, Maggie-pie has a desert dry sense of humor. YES I just called him Maggie-pie. It’s 0530, you people expect me to totally serious? Must not insert ‘Y so SRS?’ comment ANYWAY…Christ, I’m getting to be like Deadpool over here…) Mags KNOWS what Xavier faces for his continued support of him. And again, one must ask “Why?” If Charles Xavier is to be the “Good Mutant” example for everyone, the example of why mutants aren’t to be feared, that “One good Jew” everyone knew, to borrow and paraphrase a famous quote, why, by the Gods, is he maintaining a friendship with a known terrorist, and unrepentant mass murderer? (Yes, some of the murders Mags has committed he’s sorry for. But not all of them. Mags has his OWN list of unforgivable sins.) Because really, way to be a piss-poor example there Chuck.
And yet, Charles DOES. He may call Mags his ‘brother’ on a few occasions - and Mags may return that term, but it’s loaded. Oh Jesus tap-dancing Christ on a CRACKER is it loaded. And let’s not forget the whole “Michael Xavier, cousin to Charles Xavier” thing. I don’t think that would really fool anyone who’s paying attention. Anyone who knows Xavier’s family would know it’s a lie. Anyone who would hear the two of them talk would wonder why one has an American - albeit very proper and upper class - accent while the other has a softer, muddied European accent. And if Mags where to wear his shelves up…well…sorry folks, but I can’t find too many who’d buy them being cousins. ESPECIALLY not those who know their history well. The camp tattoos where a system in and of themselves, and Mags number rather ID’s him as Jewish if you know how to read them. And certainly, if anyone see Mags undressed, that story is blown. A man of his age wouldn’t be circumcised unless he was Jewish (or had a medical problem and there would be other scars). So why the cousin claim? Look at what it would benefit. The first time we see Mags using it - Xavier is very gravely ill. It skirts that ‘family only’ hospital rule nicely doesn’t it? But come on, it’s not going to fool anyone really. Magneto’s face is fairly well known.
It makes no sense, for either of them. None.
Unless they love each other.
And of this, there is no doubt. But which is it? Agápe? Éros? Philia?
As any sibling of an abusive or mentally ill person can tell you - and at times, Mags can be BOTH - there comes a time where you just can’t anymore. You can’t keep reaching out. You can’t keep loving, supporting, forgiving. You can’t maintain or even offer to maintain, a relationship. You. Just. Can’t. So…philia can be ruled out.
Agápe is…a bit difficult to define. Certainly it’s used in Christian texts in referring to Yahweh’s love for the Church. ‘Beloved’ is a good translation, as much as Ancient Greek translate to modern English, which is fairly imprecise and vague as languages go. It’s a profound, deep love. A “truer love”. This seems to almost fit. And it does. But it’s also defined as being an ‘old love’. It takes a long time for love of any type to grow into agápe.
And philia has been ruled out, here too. Because this is no ‘mere friendship’ - and I don’t mean to discount friendship. As a Scorpio, (Read up on us some time yo, we scary.) I know how deep friendship can and does run. I understand those lifelong friendships that you make. But Mags and Chuck BOTH have trust issues. Mags has ever reason to be distrustful of men, doctors, and soldiers. Chuck really hasn’t ever learned to trust anyone - most likely due to his mother’s alcoholism and his step-father’s and step-brother’s abuse - and uses his telepathy and his ability to ‘peek’ into people’s heads as a substitute. And yet, he admits, he wasn’t able to read Mags when they met. Now, grant it, this is what tipped him off to Mags being a fellow mutant and it certainly would keep him interested but trust? No, probably not. Especially to a psychiatrist, when dealing with a man with obvious (to everyone EXCEPT himself) psychological problems and mental illness. And yet…
So it’s probably not philia that drew them together.
That leaves Éros. And it makes a certain amount of sense. Because people in love (or hell, in lust) do stupid, seemingly irrational things. We’ve all seen it - people will go to lengths for a lover they would NEVER go to for a friend or family member. But would two young men, one born in the late 1920’s and the other born in the late 1930’s be comfortable enough to express that?
I think so. Let’s look at history here. In the US, leading men in Hollywood had flings, even long term semi-public (though quiet) relationships with men. Homosexuality was more tolerated in the 1920’s than later in the century, and even if both boys were born after that, their parents were not. Their generation is the one you often hear “Do what you want but keep it QUIET” from, rather than the boomer (and later) generation of “OMG WRONG”. At the same time…Mags doesn’t really consider himself ‘human’ - he’s something evolved passed baseline humans, in his mind. Xavier might not think that but he certainly feels himself above society’s rules. They are both attractive men. Attractive young men when they met. A physical relationship is certainly not out of the question. More than likely, it didn’t progress very far. Or, as I see it, was progressing that far. Perhaps started with some innocent flirting. (Don’t know what that is? Go watch M.A.S.H. and Hawkeye and Hunnicutt interact.) Perhaps some drunken fumbling fooling around. To my mind it doesn’t actually matter. SOMETHING happened. And, let’s face it, Xavier was in a sexual relationship with someone - Gabrielle Haller - during the time in Israel and Mags isn’t the type to cheat. But it still isn’t beyond the possibility that the two young men did have some kind of physical relationship, something broken off, perhaps by their own inability to deal with it. But that bond remained. And that’s what I think happened.
…Boy can I talk a LOT about headcanon. Shesh.
I suppose I could add my own meta to this.
But I really can’t see any version of them where they weren’t, at least, in love with each other. Perhaps not a couple, but in love - in fact, ‘in love’ but never acted upon makes a LOT of sense in some canons.
But I’m aware too often people (-uh hem- young people) forget there are many types of love. I mean, there is Agápe, Éros, and Philaand ALL of them mean love - just different types. The question I’ve always had was WHAT type applied to them.
I’ve seen a real (shocking and sickening) devolution in how friendships, specifically between men, are portrayed and excepted to be. I’ve seen is said - and agree - that men are almost taught to be homophobic because men cannot have deep, meaningful, intimate relationships with other men - unless they are lovers. And this has been a fairly recent occurrence. What really cemented that SOMETHING was going on was seeing scans from ‘ At Ease’ - which everyone should read. Has some STUNNING pictures let me tell you. (And Sean buddy? Buddy? Pal? Secret telepathic lover? Friend o’mine? I promise to share scans when I get it.) ANYWAY. The book shows a lot of WWII photographs of young men within Magneto’s same generation. Most older than him, obviously, but only by a handful of years.
The casualness and body language shown between men who weren’t taught to fear affection and touch from other men, even when being nude, didn’t always MATCH the body language shown in the comics between Mags and Chuck. It was friendly, yes, but there were…edges there. Some rough, hurty, painful - these two have done some serious SHIT to each other, and betrayed each other on levels most people would consider unforgivable. Mags isn’t one to consider betray forgivable. And yet, what Charles did as far as attempting to mindwipe him was just THAT. Everything he IS, Charles tried to ease. That’s worse than trying to murder him. No one ALIVE remembers his beloved Anya. His family. Isabelle. Everything he’s seen - he’s borne witness to so much. And so many dead. Some of these people only have names BECAUSE he remembers them. And Charles tried to take that away. There is only person who has ever betrayed him on such a deep level and he’s not turned on. His wife. (Magda and that whole mess is a WHOLE other meta post I won’t subject people to. Promise. Ok, maybe, FOR NOW. DAMMIT BRAIN Now I’m wanting to do monthly meta posts on my headcanon FUUUUUUUUUUUUUCK. A. DUCK, BRAIN WHY YOU DO THIS?!.) So what do I draw from this? The people Mags loves are dear to him, we know this. And certainly, Mags has some intimacy issues. Anyone with the degree of controlling behavior he displays will. And ignoring what happened on Magda’s end - be it ignorance, spite/fear, mental illness - I’ve seen all those theories - on why she abandoned him in the first place (’Cause that’s not the POINT right now, and as I said, a whole other meta post. Which. I. Will. NOT. Do. Right. Now.) looking at it from Mags’ end, it’s the ONE single action he refers back to as proof that humans cannot, will not, ever be able to accept mutants. After everything that he suffered, that nearly destroyed him.
Magneto’s identity has always been important for him. Names, not so much. His name has changed, a lot. If someone were to shout “Max!” in a crowded room, it wouldn’t dawn on him to look around. It someone shouted “Eisenhardt!” it might startle him, but he wouldn’t think HE was being addressed. “Erik”, yes, he would respond. “Magnus”? Ditto. Perhaps - given how recently he’s used it - “Michael” - but more than likely, he’d only respond in if there weren’t that many people to be addressed or if he’d recently used the alias. Ditto with “Xavier”. But for this ONE woman, he was willing to deny everything he was, to find her. To be with her. He could never have been a practicing Jew so long as they lived with the Roma - not that he was. But he couldn’t have even been a secular one - which he is. He would have had to have adopted them as his own people or not have been accepted. And given the reluctance we see Magda showing in moving away from her people - and the areas she ran to when she left him - it’s clear she wasn’t comfortable not being with her people. And while the Camps weren’t just set up for Jews, the ‘Final Solution’ was. In giving up his Jewish identity, Mags was giving up a huge core of who he was, of the forces that shaped him. It’s not surprise to me at all that after he accepted she was gone, he felt the need to ‘find himself’ and fled to Israel. But what she did - whatever the reason - was a huge betrayal. He’d risked so much for her - abuse from schoolmates as children, his family’s (his FATHER’S) disapproval. His life when he was protecting her in the camps. His life after - when he’s shown having to carry her at times when they escaped. His life again, when their home was on fire. And she LEFT him. Everything he’d done, everything he’d given up, all the love he felt for her - and in one instant, one single, solitary instant, she threw it all away. As if it meant nothing. That’s one helluva huge slap in the face folks. And yet - he still loves her. Some of it, certainly, has to do with him loving the idea of her, what she represented (normalcy, a family, hope, peace, love, acceptance) and him having a certain amount of youthful - dare I say, innocent? - blinders on when it comes to her. But the fact is, he’s forgiven her the hurt she caused. (Now…if she showed up alive? Prolly a different story!) And he still loves her.
When Xavier attempted that mindwipe, he wasn’t asking (as Magda was) for Mags to give up his identity - he tried to take it away. That’s a violent, horrible act. It’s been called in some circles telepathic rape - an utter violation of the core of Magneto. And it was. Of all the things Xavier has done - and he’s done a fair amount - that one is pretty unforgivable in my book. He doesn’t even have the “I meant well!” good intentions behind it - not that that would make it any better. And yet…Mags - who really doesn’t know how to forgive, who holds grudges for years, who cannot ever let go of the past, who STILL is angry with Moria MacTagget for “manipulating” his DNA, even if he is mostly over the hostility - forgave Xavier. And is still friendly with him. Still trusts him.
Wait. WHAT?
And what did Mags do? Attacked the one member of Xavier’s team who he KNEW would heal what he was going to do, but knew it would hurt Xavier terribly. Really, most of their fights read a great deal like domestic fights that have gotten frighteningly out of hand. They read, quite often, like a couple trapped in a perpetual cycle of together/break-up/hate/forgive/together. That one couple in every neighborhood, that have gotten together, broken up, gotten back together, broken back up, repeat ad nauseam.
Am I serious? Certainly! Add that in with other things.
Mags has friends - and can carry on friendships, even if they are superficial or end badly - but these are all women. The man really isn’t able to maintain a deep, lasting friendship. There is an exception to both of these - Xavier. Look through his history, and there is only Xavier as the one, not only constant, but only man in Mags’ life who is treated at all as an equal.
Who is the person Xavier calls on when he needs someone he knows will remain (possibly stupidly) loyal to him? Magneto. And let’s face it - Xavier isn’t a saint. Mags has betrayed him a lot. Left him a lot. Put the people he loves - or should love - most in extreme danger, if not tried or threatened to kill. Why would he forgive and be willing to move passed it? In Excalibur, Mags questions him on attempting to save someone, and Xavier points out how many times he’s been asked that about Wolverine. ‘Dreamer,’ Mags replies. ‘Or you,’ Xavier says. ‘Idealist then.’ But there’s humor to it. (Yes, Maggie-pie has a desert dry sense of humor. YES I just called him Maggie-pie. It’s 0530, you people expect me to totally serious? Must not insert ‘Y so SRS?’ comment ANYWAY…Christ, I’m getting to be like Deadpool over here…) Mags KNOWS what Xavier faces for his continued support of him. And again, one must ask “Why?” If Charles Xavier is to be the “Good Mutant” example for everyone, the example of why mutants aren’t to be feared, that “One good Jew” everyone knew, to borrow and paraphrase a famous quote, why, by the Gods, is he maintaining a friendship with a known terrorist, and unrepentant mass murderer? (Yes, some of the murders Mags has committed he’s sorry for. But not all of them. Mags has his OWN list of unforgivable sins.) Because really, way to be a piss-poor example there Chuck.
And yet, Charles DOES. He may call Mags his ‘brother’ on a few occasions - and Mags may return that term, but it’s loaded. Oh Jesus tap-dancing Christ on a CRACKER is it loaded. And let’s not forget the whole “Michael Xavier, cousin to Charles Xavier” thing. I don’t think that would really fool anyone who’s paying attention. Anyone who knows Xavier’s family would know it’s a lie. Anyone who would hear the two of them talk would wonder why one has an American - albeit very proper and upper class - accent while the other has a softer, muddied European accent. And if Mags where to wear his shelves up…well…sorry folks, but I can’t find too many who’d buy them being cousins. ESPECIALLY not those who know their history well. The camp tattoos where a system in and of themselves, and Mags number rather ID’s him as Jewish if you know how to read them. And certainly, if anyone see Mags undressed, that story is blown. A man of his age wouldn’t be circumcised unless he was Jewish (or had a medical problem and there would be other scars). So why the cousin claim? Look at what it would benefit. The first time we see Mags using it - Xavier is very gravely ill. It skirts that ‘family only’ hospital rule nicely doesn’t it? But come on, it’s not going to fool anyone really. Magneto’s face is fairly well known.
It makes no sense, for either of them. None.
Unless they love each other.
And of this, there is no doubt. But which is it? Agápe? Éros? Philia?
As any sibling of an abusive or mentally ill person can tell you - and at times, Mags can be BOTH - there comes a time where you just can’t anymore. You can’t keep reaching out. You can’t keep loving, supporting, forgiving. You can’t maintain or even offer to maintain, a relationship. You. Just. Can’t. So…philia can be ruled out.
Agápe is…a bit difficult to define. Certainly it’s used in Christian texts in referring to Yahweh’s love for the Church. ‘Beloved’ is a good translation, as much as Ancient Greek translate to modern English, which is fairly imprecise and vague as languages go. It’s a profound, deep love. A “truer love”. This seems to almost fit. And it does. But it’s also defined as being an ‘old love’. It takes a long time for love of any type to grow into agápe.
And philia has been ruled out, here too. Because this is no ‘mere friendship’ - and I don’t mean to discount friendship. As a Scorpio, (Read up on us some time yo, we scary.) I know how deep friendship can and does run. I understand those lifelong friendships that you make. But Mags and Chuck BOTH have trust issues. Mags has ever reason to be distrustful of men, doctors, and soldiers. Chuck really hasn’t ever learned to trust anyone - most likely due to his mother’s alcoholism and his step-father’s and step-brother’s abuse - and uses his telepathy and his ability to ‘peek’ into people’s heads as a substitute. And yet, he admits, he wasn’t able to read Mags when they met. Now, grant it, this is what tipped him off to Mags being a fellow mutant and it certainly would keep him interested but trust? No, probably not. Especially to a psychiatrist, when dealing with a man with obvious (to everyone EXCEPT himself) psychological problems and mental illness. And yet…
So it’s probably not philia that drew them together.
That leaves Éros. And it makes a certain amount of sense. Because people in love (or hell, in lust) do stupid, seemingly irrational things. We’ve all seen it - people will go to lengths for a lover they would NEVER go to for a friend or family member. But would two young men, one born in the late 1920’s and the other born in the late 1930’s be comfortable enough to express that?
I think so. Let’s look at history here. In the US, leading men in Hollywood had flings, even long term semi-public (though quiet) relationships with men. Homosexuality was more tolerated in the 1920’s than later in the century, and even if both boys were born after that, their parents were not. Their generation is the one you often hear “Do what you want but keep it QUIET” from, rather than the boomer (and later) generation of “OMG WRONG”. At the same time…Mags doesn’t really consider himself ‘human’ - he’s something evolved passed baseline humans, in his mind. Xavier might not think that but he certainly feels himself above society’s rules. They are both attractive men. Attractive young men when they met. A physical relationship is certainly not out of the question. More than likely, it didn’t progress very far. Or, as I see it, was progressing that far. Perhaps started with some innocent flirting. (Don’t know what that is? Go watch M.A.S.H. and Hawkeye and Hunnicutt interact.) Perhaps some drunken fumbling fooling around. To my mind it doesn’t actually matter. SOMETHING happened. And, let’s face it, Xavier was in a sexual relationship with someone - Gabrielle Haller - during the time in Israel and Mags isn’t the type to cheat. But it still isn’t beyond the possibility that the two young men did have some kind of physical relationship, something broken off, perhaps by their own inability to deal with it. But that bond remained. And that’s what I think happened.
…Boy can I talk a LOT about headcanon. Shesh.