Cool math problem for those that like such things

Aug 07, 2004 17:48

So, I was out to dinner with sunshine__girl, browascension, and lightling. We were going to play a game and we decided to play paper-scissors-rock to see who would go first. Instead of pairing off, we decided to keep playing until it was unambiguous (i.e. if two people did scissors, and two did rocks, the two scissors would be eliminated, but if there were one of each we'd all go ( Read more... )

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maustin August 7 2004, 22:04:57 UTC
Yeah- actually I think I didn't explain the game well :)

lets say 2 people do paper, one person does scissors and one person does rock (out of 4 people). Nobody has to leave the game, because there was no clear winner. So if everyone chooses the same, or all of paper, scissors, and rock are present, the game must continue.

With 2 players, there is a 2/3 chance of the game ending and a 1/3 chance of the game continuing. So you get:

F(2) = 1 + 1/3 * F(2)
which is
1+1/3+1/9+1/27+... = 1 / (1-(1/3)) = 1.5 rounds

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wkiri August 8 2004, 00:35:05 UTC
Good point -- I used the wrong recurrence! No sense keeping the incorrect derivation around, especially since it didn't even address the proper game. Thanks for your clarifications.

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p_n(i) candid August 10 2004, 10:11:31 UTC
First, if i=0, then p_n(i)=0, since there's no way to eliminate everybody.

Next, if 0 < i < n, then p_n(i) = 3 * [n choose i] / 3^n,

since, to get from n to i, you need i people to choose (rock / paper / scissors) and n-i people to choose (scissors / rock / paper), which can happen 3 * [n choose i] ways. Since there are 3^n possible "throws" that does it.

And, otherwise, you stick at n, which (just by summing) gives

p_n(n) = [3^n - 3(2^n - 2)] / 3^n.

Alternatively, to leave n, you need _exactly_ 2 of the 3 items to appear, which can happen

3 * (2^n - 2) ways

(since, for instance, there are 2^n - 2 ways people can throw only rock and paper, but at least one of each)

which means that there are

3^n - 3* (2^n -2) ways to stay at n.

That's an ugly expression and makes me doubt that you'll find a good closed-form solution for the original problem.

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