McGonagall and Umbridge

[merrymelody]

McGonagall - described by both the narrative and many fans (adella711 and I both recently took polls reflecting this, so even 'subversive' readers such as slashers seem to agree) as the fairest teacher at Hogwarts.
Umbridge - loathed by text and audience alike.
But are they so different?

Comments

[merrymelody]

I think what it comes down to is that the author wants us, the audience, to assume Draco bought his way onto the team.Indeed. Fiera makes a good point, which is the two people who inform us that he bought his way on aren't particularly unbiased

[merrymelody]

Maybe men know if you have your hero playing against somebody so inferior he had to buy his way onto the team you've emasculated him as well.

Excellent point.
Harry's fighting Malfoy, who is essentially a very female character - catty, gossipy, socially adept.
As recently as GoF, however, Malfoy could at least match Harry in a duel (as he did in CoS), even if he lets girls hit him and runs away from danger.
Now he's unadept magically (the trip jinx, for example, being basically a Muggle trick, plus him being 'too slow' to go for his wand in a fight, physically incapable...
Harry's beginning to look as if he's fighting someone who literally can't defend themself, especially in light of Harry's Super Special new powers (good teacher! Able to read minds! Popular with 3/4 of the school! More confident both with fame, granting interviews with the press; and women! Assured Aurorhood!)

[sistermagpie]

This is, I think, something a lot of people feel strongly about and get very suspicious if you disagree with it...which is probably why the first character I've ever sort of identified with in a small way was Marietta Edgecomb. I could just so see myself in her position--her friend likes this boy and drags me to the meeting of the club he's setting up. I get to work on my DADA and learn stuff, so far so good. I think the guy seems like a jerk, maybe, but my friend likes him and hey, personality doesn't mean he's a bad person. Then I start to think, "Oh, hang on. These guys are really scary and according to my mom who's always presented a very reasonable view of the Ministry, they're probably terrorists. And I can believe it what with the fanatical gleam in everyone's eye

[merrymelody]

Then I start to think, "Oh, hang on. These guys are really scary and according to my mom who's always presented a very reasonable view of the Ministry, they're probably terrorists. And I can believe it what with the fanatical gleam in everyone's eye."The DA didn't exactly go to pains to make themselves appear reasonable, what with their frightening hatred of Umbridge

[aybara_max]

First of all, it's hard to even seriously reply to this "essay" since it's more of a scattered laundry list of complaints that goes wildly off-topic throwing in analyses of Harry, Snape, Neville, Peter, Dumbledore etc. That said, here's an attempt at a coherent response:

Okay wait scratch that, essay complaint: when citing an example (Philosopher's Stone, page 111-) please specify hard/softcover or at least include the friggin example..what the heck are you talking about???

Actually, I've changed my mind, this is really just a personal bitchfest about the books, so there's not really any need for me to join in. I just wish these discussions didn't get promoted as essays as if there was actually balanced and researched information in here.

[merrymelody]

Hi there! Nice to meet you - you seem a polite, friendly person!
Certainly if I were posting this is in a community such as hp_essays, it would have to fulfill certain guidelines.
However, since this is my personal livejournal, you're under no obligation to visit, stay or 'join in'.
I presume you came via the daily_snitch?
I noticed the link, and the mods didn't 'promote' this as an essay, or even 'balanced and researched information'. Merely a comparison.
If you have any problems with the way the way that particular journal is run, I suggest you address them to snitch@arithmancy.net

[aybara_max]

sorry, crankiness during the day rubbing off on LJ. I wanted to check what you were referring to and got frustrated so I did a mini-rant which I've never done before. Pretty much in disagreement with most of the post simply because I don't really see a comparison between McGonagall and Umbridge, especially not one that can be reduced to comparing embarassing and uncomforatble ear-pulling to submitting a student repeatedly to a sadistic and psychologically damaging detention of carving up your own hand. I just don't think there is the same underlying attiditude or motive behind those behaviors

[merrymelody]

I don't think ear-pulling is on the same level as forcing someone to self-mutilate (although I do think that neither has a place in teacher-student relations.)

I guess the point I was trying to express (and obviously badly!) is a point made by someone commenting on this entry: "the very thing held against one character can be celebrated in another."

I don't think McGonagall's, or for that matter Snape's, or Dumbledore's or anyone else that I brought up's motives are similiar to Umbridge's - I believe that McGonagall, for example's motives are genuine, and that she believes herself to be fair, and a good teacher.
I also, however, believe that her reputation as being 'fair' is unjustified, whether her biases are conscious or unconscious.

[sunnyskywalker]

Minerva doesn't directly harm students, and puts a stop to "Moody" doing so... but she is happy to punish them by putting them in situations where they might get killed. Unicorn killer on the loose in the Forbidden Forest? Send them in at night with Hagrid and hope nothing goes wrong! Mass-murderer on the loose in the castle? Make Neville sit out like a goat staked up as bait and see if being in fear of his life improves his memory! I can't say I approve of either Umbridge's or McGonagall's methods