Panel recap: Teamwork Makes the Dream Work! (ensemble fandoms and writing them)
Thank you everyone for an awesome con, and for the scant dozen people who decided to discuss ensembles rather than Steve Rogers :)
What makes an ensemble?
- at least 5 people; odd numbers work best.
- each person must talk to at least one other person
What makes it good?
- make sure you address what each person wants
- if you use a person as an instrument to push plot etc, make sure they are still themselves
- if you take out the 'ship, what is everyone else doing?
- "if they're making things worse, you're probably doing it right"
- remember that side characters don't always have the same information
- think of it like Lego; the right pieces in the right place, but don't stick in a piece of cardboard
- have emotional investment in your supporting characters
Ensemble members can hate each other: Orange is the New Black, Game of Thrones, Homicide, Oz, The Sopranos.
Ensemble fic is terrific if you like to write long and do character development. More people help each other develop because of a multitude of interactions.
Relatedly, TV shows do better at ensembles than movies do. Good writing *and* good cinematography can work wonders for good quick explications of side characters. (Eg. Joss Whedon.)
A good vid (we all thought of the Brooklyn Nine-Nine vid shown on Friday night) can really show how every member of the ensemble works together.
AU settings that are popular and helpful are ones where everyone is forced into a tight social circle: high school, coffee shop, military, political campaign, starships/outer space, family, found-family, sports team
There was a comment that family AUs can only be about the grownups.
There was a comment that sports team and military AUs need to address the homophobia in those settings.
Note: family ensembles take place primarily in the home, while coworker teams tend to happen all over the place including each others' homes.
Digression into wolf packs and ABO; per Piper, this doesn't reflect wolves in the wild at all. Wolves in the wild are analogous to parents (alpha), older siblings with responsibilities who play rough (beta), and little kids (omega).
Examples of canon that fails to be an ensemble: Gundam Wing, Doctor Who, Pern?
(It was noted that vidders and writers have made Gundam Wing into a good ensemble.)
Examples of canon that do it right: The West Wing, Babylon 5, Orphan Black, Fast and the Furious
Writers talking about their ensemble process; John Finnemore of Cabin Pressure has a radio show about his process
What happens in a canon that's suffering from team-bloat?
How do you avoid oversimplified and downright derogatory characterizations?
What makes an ensemble unreadable/unwatchable?
How do you choose your scenes in vids? (None of us were vidders.)
How do you keep track of your characters?
What happens when a canon *becomes* a team/ensemble?
Cross-platform:
Bleach
Dragonball Z
Harry Potter
Justice League (DC) and related (Young Justice...)
Magnificent Seven
Marvel Cinematic Universe
Star Trek
Star Wars (original trilogy, Clone Wars, Rebels...)
Teenage Mutant Ninja Turtles
X-Men
TV:
The 100
Avatar: The Last Airbender / Korra
Babylon 5
Barney Miller
Battlestar Galactica
Brooklyn Nine-Nine
Buffy the Vampire Slayer (except when it wasn't)
Castle
Empire
Firefly / Serenity
The Flash
Leverage
The Librarians
M*A*S*H
Miss Fisher's Murder Mysteries
Numb3rs
Orphan Black
Parks & Recreation
Sleepy Hollow
Spooks / MI-5
Stargate SG-1 etc.
Vampire Diaries
The West Wing
White Collar
Comics & Manga:
Ody-C
Rat Queens
Runaways
Saga
Movies:
Fast & Furious (in later movies)
Pacific Rim
Books: (this might reflect my personal preferences...)
Louisa May Alcott, Little Women trilogy
Joan Aiken, YA alternate 18th century history, also transformations on Jane Austen, also adult books.
Christopher Fry, The Lady's Not for Burning
Ellen Kushner, Swordspoint series
C.S. Lewis, Narnia series
Anne McCaffrey, Pern universe (sometimes)
Seanan McGuire, InCryptid series, October Daye series
L.M. Montgomery, Anne of Green Gables (particularly the not Anne-centric books)
Terry Pratchett, Discworld series
J.R.R. Tolkien, Lord of the Rings etc.
Here are some of my personal fanfic recs:
http://archiveofourown.org/users/rthstewart/ (Narnia Big Bang works, among other things)
ysabetwordsmith (who also writes amazing original crowd-funded epic poetry with ensemble casts)
http://archiveofourown.org/users/dsudis (I mentioned her wolfbrother stuff, but she does EVERYTHING)
http://archiveofourown.org/users/rubynye
So much else to say! Please continue the conversation!
What makes an ensemble?
- at least 5 people; odd numbers work best.
- each person must talk to at least one other person
What makes it good?
- make sure you address what each person wants
- if you use a person as an instrument to push plot etc, make sure they are still themselves
- if you take out the 'ship, what is everyone else doing?
- "if they're making things worse, you're probably doing it right"
- remember that side characters don't always have the same information
- think of it like Lego; the right pieces in the right place, but don't stick in a piece of cardboard
- have emotional investment in your supporting characters
Ensemble members can hate each other: Orange is the New Black, Game of Thrones, Homicide, Oz, The Sopranos.
Ensemble fic is terrific if you like to write long and do character development. More people help each other develop because of a multitude of interactions.
Relatedly, TV shows do better at ensembles than movies do. Good writing *and* good cinematography can work wonders for good quick explications of side characters. (Eg. Joss Whedon.)
A good vid (we all thought of the Brooklyn Nine-Nine vid shown on Friday night) can really show how every member of the ensemble works together.
AU settings that are popular and helpful are ones where everyone is forced into a tight social circle: high school, coffee shop, military, political campaign, starships/outer space, family, found-family, sports team
There was a comment that family AUs can only be about the grownups.
There was a comment that sports team and military AUs need to address the homophobia in those settings.
Note: family ensembles take place primarily in the home, while coworker teams tend to happen all over the place including each others' homes.
Digression into wolf packs and ABO; per Piper, this doesn't reflect wolves in the wild at all. Wolves in the wild are analogous to parents (alpha), older siblings with responsibilities who play rough (beta), and little kids (omega).
Examples of canon that fails to be an ensemble: Gundam Wing, Doctor Who, Pern?
(It was noted that vidders and writers have made Gundam Wing into a good ensemble.)
Examples of canon that do it right: The West Wing, Babylon 5, Orphan Black, Fast and the Furious
Writers talking about their ensemble process; John Finnemore of Cabin Pressure has a radio show about his process
What happens in a canon that's suffering from team-bloat?
How do you avoid oversimplified and downright derogatory characterizations?
What makes an ensemble unreadable/unwatchable?
How do you choose your scenes in vids? (None of us were vidders.)
How do you keep track of your characters?
What happens when a canon *becomes* a team/ensemble?
Cross-platform:
Bleach
Dragonball Z
Harry Potter
Justice League (DC) and related (Young Justice...)
Magnificent Seven
Marvel Cinematic Universe
Star Trek
Star Wars (original trilogy, Clone Wars, Rebels...)
Teenage Mutant Ninja Turtles
X-Men
TV:
The 100
Avatar: The Last Airbender / Korra
Babylon 5
Barney Miller
Battlestar Galactica
Brooklyn Nine-Nine
Buffy the Vampire Slayer (except when it wasn't)
Castle
Empire
Firefly / Serenity
The Flash
Leverage
The Librarians
M*A*S*H
Miss Fisher's Murder Mysteries
Numb3rs
Orphan Black
Parks & Recreation
Sleepy Hollow
Spooks / MI-5
Stargate SG-1 etc.
Vampire Diaries
The West Wing
White Collar
Comics & Manga:
Ody-C
Rat Queens
Runaways
Saga
Movies:
Fast & Furious (in later movies)
Pacific Rim
Books: (this might reflect my personal preferences...)
Louisa May Alcott, Little Women trilogy
Joan Aiken, YA alternate 18th century history, also transformations on Jane Austen, also adult books.
Christopher Fry, The Lady's Not for Burning
Ellen Kushner, Swordspoint series
C.S. Lewis, Narnia series
Anne McCaffrey, Pern universe (sometimes)
Seanan McGuire, InCryptid series, October Daye series
L.M. Montgomery, Anne of Green Gables (particularly the not Anne-centric books)
Terry Pratchett, Discworld series
J.R.R. Tolkien, Lord of the Rings etc.
Here are some of my personal fanfic recs:
http://archiveofourown.org/users/rthstewart/ (Narnia Big Bang works, among other things)
ysabetwordsmith (who also writes amazing original crowd-funded epic poetry with ensemble casts)
http://archiveofourown.org/users/dsudis (I mentioned her wolfbrother stuff, but she does EVERYTHING)
http://archiveofourown.org/users/rubynye
So much else to say! Please continue the conversation!