Okay, in the flood of eulogies for Ten/nant, I keep seeing this comment, that Rose only fell in love with the Doctor/had sexual chemistry with him once Ten arrived. I'm sorry, but are people really that bad at reading body language?
Huh? Rose and Nine were incredibly sexy together. And loved each other so very much. And transformed each other - in a good way. They were... radiant... together.
But in this sort of thing, everyone has their own perception of relationships and characters. So some people don't see it. It's like being slash-blind.
As for sexual chemistry, I've never seen such sexual chemistry on TV as in "Boom Town".
Rose and Nine were incredibly sexy together. And loved each other so very much. And transformed each other - in a good way. They were... radiant... together.
I obviously agree, and I think "radiant" is a good description, in that I felt like they were almost uncomfortably "hot", but it was in a strangely light/innocent way that nonetheless has power/depth. "Boom Town" is a great example of being sexy and light, between all three of them. And it wasn't "told", it was just shown, which always works so much better for me. Same with "The Long Game" - like "Boom Town", not much of a story, but some wonderful interaction.
"Boom Town" is a great example of being sexy and light, between all three of them.
I agree absolutely. This is why it is one of my very favourite episodes. Such a perfect picture of people who fave fallen deeply in love, and are filled with the joy of it.
Same with "The Long Game" - like "Boom Town", not much of a story, but some wonderful interaction.
You already know my take on that old trope. Seriously, author? Just because Nine might not Do It for you (for whatever mad reason that might be), it does not mean Rose didn't want him.
Frankly, I think anyone who watches "Bad Wolf" and doesn't see the "Take me now!" look on Rose's face when the Doctor calls out the Daleks needs her eyes examined, but that's just me.
I think what frustrates me is that it's so blatantly about the POV of the watcher and not the show. Or, it's rewriting history. Seeing the POTW kiss there reminds me that Billie, Julie G, and John B are doing the commentary, and they all "ooh and ah", and JB says something like, 'Oooooh, we've - they've - been waiting for that for 13 episodes".
It's a complex interaction of layers of narrative drive/dialogue/acting/acted body language/genuine body language as well - I know that they were writing/playing a relationship between Ten and Rose, but I didn't "feel" it as sexual, or at least not the same kind of sexual - still, I'm not going to say people are crazy for seeing it. I'm just saying it doesn't do it for me. To make an egregious comparison, I love Astaire/Rogers films, but they are not at all sexy to me (okay, maybe "Night and Day," a little, but he ruins it by being an ass at the end) - Gene Kelly and Judy Garland sitting on a porch, however, can be steamy as all get out (see, Summer Stock, an otherwise
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Somebody--anybody?--said that?? Good Lord, where were they looking?? Somewhere on the season one DW Confidential disk there's a shot, maybe two seconds, where CE and BP are kidding around between takes. There's no music, but he slides his arms around her and starts dancing, and she follows him perfectly. Matched steps were accompanied by happy, mischievous, and knowing grins. Looked like the tango to me, guys.
Quite a lot of people have said it - people with blogs on reputable news sites, even. I don't get it. I made my Astaire/Rogers, Kelly/Garland comparison in my response to honorh above. I don't care for Ten/Rose, I find the relationship problematic on a number of levels, but I completely accept that there is a relationship being portrayed (cf Astaire/Rogers). I'm just more responsive to the more "unsaid, unstructured" relationships (Nine/Rose, Kelly/Garland).
Perhaps it would have been clearer from the first without SyFy channel's meddlesome editing out of much of the character/relationship development.
They removed, for example, the "You're beautiful!" scene from TUD! However, they then left in both moments in FD when Pete, then Nine, cradles Rose's face in his hand. Mixed message much?
Naturally, of course, you can count me in on seeing the sizzling Nine/Rose chemistry now!
[I love the edited out hug from Dalek that shows up in the Confidential. Waaaay, hotter than the edited out kiss from JE!]
Perhaps it would have been clearer from the first without SyFy channel's meddlesome editing out of much of the character/relationship development.
I'm not sure that would make that much of a difference, though it couldn't help. But there's still an awful lot of body language. There was a whole hell of a lot more naturalism in S1 than in S2 - that struck me again, recently, looking at it. I don't mean in the stories, obviously, but in the acting. Billie was so good in S1, probably the best she's ever been. I know that she got to be friends with David Tennant, but I wish she could look at how she acted with Christopher Eccleston and appreciate that. (As much as it was telegraphed - or perhaps because it was - I never bought the Ten/Rose chemistry as genuine, except for one fleeting moment in "Fear Her"; I honestly thought that at some point, there was going to be something about desperation and denial, because that's what I was seeing.)
Oh, yes indeed! That's what I mean about the Hug. When CE grabs her up, BP is completely fluid and accepting. There's no resistance, she's receptive. They come together abruptly, and yet, each curves naturally into the other. As I said: Hot!
And that 2-second clip is just one example of many s1 instances (though never enough before CE left).
CE grabs her up, BP is completely fluid and accepting. There's no resistance, she's receptive. They come together abruptly, and yet, each curves naturally into the other. As I said: Hot!
This is the thing that does make them incredibly hot. It seems intuitive, natural, unacted. And you're absolutely right about that hug. It was supposed to be "protective" apparently, but he seems so vulnerable, and her response is so… well, sexual. The way her knee goes around his thigh and she arches into him, even as she curves her arm around his head. I just don't see planning in that reaction, it's intimacy of a sort that seems entirely earned. And they had that from the beginning - geez, even Bogart and Bacall looked a little tense in To Have and Have Not.
As I was saying in another comment, I was hit by how sexual their chemistry was even in "Rose" not just because they were right in each other's space walking, but because she kept turning to him with her chest open. You just don't do that with someone you've just met - usually, even if a
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I have to say that when I watched Nine, I thought that he actually did love Rose and that she loved him, too and I got the same vibe from Ten and Rose. Since I'm a Doctor/Master shipper, I think it's safe to say that it was fairly obvious with both Doctors. So, if people say that Rose only loved him when Ten came along, they just didn't want to see it. It's amazing what we can see (or not see as the case may be) when we want to.
On the one hand, I'm like, "Whatever, it's just a tv show," but there's a part of me that always thinks, "Geez, are these people as bad at real life?"
I see chemistry in all three cases, but in each case, it's composed differently: with Nine and Rose, it feels like sheer physical heat at the beginning (I remember watching "Rose", stunned, thinking, "There's no hanky panky in the TARDIS! but how are they not going to?) that deepens through the series; Ten and Rose feel like high school sweethearts (I'll be honest, I thought at first they were trying so hard to make it an epic romance that that was going to be a plot point, that things really had changed after the regeneration, but I still thought that they were friends with benefits/partners-in-crime); with the Doctor/Master, it was such a product of the writing. They're all valid - in fact, they're kind of like a smorgasbord of "how to create or exploit chemistry".
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But in this sort of thing, everyone has their own perception of relationships and characters. So some people don't see it. It's like being slash-blind.
As for sexual chemistry, I've never seen such sexual chemistry on TV as in "Boom Town".
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I obviously agree, and I think "radiant" is a good description, in that I felt like they were almost uncomfortably "hot", but it was in a strangely light/innocent way that nonetheless has power/depth. "Boom Town" is a great example of being sexy and light, between all three of them. And it wasn't "told", it was just shown, which always works so much better for me. Same with "The Long Game" - like "Boom Town", not much of a story, but some wonderful interaction.
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I agree absolutely. This is why it is one of my very favourite episodes. Such a perfect picture of people who fave fallen deeply in love, and are filled with the joy of it.
Same with "The Long Game" - like "Boom Town", not much of a story, but some wonderful interaction.
Yes. And superb characterization.
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Frankly, I think anyone who watches "Bad Wolf" and doesn't see the "Take me now!" look on Rose's face when the Doctor calls out the Daleks needs her eyes examined, but that's just me.
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I think what frustrates me is that it's so blatantly about the POV of the watcher and not the show. Or, it's rewriting history. Seeing the POTW kiss there reminds me that Billie, Julie G, and John B are doing the commentary, and they all "ooh and ah", and JB says something like, 'Oooooh, we've - they've - been waiting for that for 13 episodes".
It's a complex interaction of layers of narrative drive/dialogue/acting/acted body language/genuine body language as well - I know that they were writing/playing a relationship between Ten and Rose, but I didn't "feel" it as sexual, or at least not the same kind of sexual - still, I'm not going to say people are crazy for seeing it. I'm just saying it doesn't do it for me. To make an egregious comparison, I love Astaire/Rogers films, but they are not at all sexy to me (okay, maybe "Night and Day," a little, but he ruins it by being an ass at the end) - Gene Kelly and Judy Garland sitting on a porch, however, can be steamy as all get out (see, Summer Stock, an otherwise ( ... )
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Wow! And, oh, golly -- Yes!
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They removed, for example, the "You're beautiful!" scene from TUD! However, they then left in both moments in FD when Pete, then Nine, cradles Rose's face in his hand. Mixed message much?
Naturally, of course, you can count me in on seeing the sizzling Nine/Rose chemistry now!
[I love the edited out hug from Dalek that shows up in the Confidential. Waaaay, hotter than the edited out kiss from JE!]
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I'm not sure that would make that much of a difference, though it couldn't help. But there's still an awful lot of body language. There was a whole hell of a lot more naturalism in S1 than in S2 - that struck me again, recently, looking at it. I don't mean in the stories, obviously, but in the acting. Billie was so good in S1, probably the best she's ever been. I know that she got to be friends with David Tennant, but I wish she could look at how she acted with Christopher Eccleston and appreciate that. (As much as it was telegraphed - or perhaps because it was - I never bought the Ten/Rose chemistry as genuine, except for one fleeting moment in "Fear Her"; I honestly thought that at some point, there was going to be something about desperation and denial, because that's what I was seeing.)
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Oh, yes indeed! That's what I mean about the Hug. When CE grabs her up, BP is completely fluid and accepting. There's no resistance, she's receptive. They come together abruptly, and yet, each curves naturally into the other. As I said: Hot!
And that 2-second clip is just one example of many s1 instances (though never enough before CE left).
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This is the thing that does make them incredibly hot. It seems intuitive, natural, unacted. And you're absolutely right about that hug. It was supposed to be "protective" apparently, but he seems so vulnerable, and her response is so… well, sexual. The way her knee goes around his thigh and she arches into him, even as she curves her arm around his head. I just don't see planning in that reaction, it's intimacy of a sort that seems entirely earned. And they had that from the beginning - geez, even Bogart and Bacall looked a little tense in To Have and Have Not.
As I was saying in another comment, I was hit by how sexual their chemistry was even in "Rose" not just because they were right in each other's space walking, but because she kept turning to him with her chest open. You just don't do that with someone you've just met - usually, even if a ( ... )
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I see chemistry in all three cases, but in each case, it's composed differently: with Nine and Rose, it feels like sheer physical heat at the beginning (I remember watching "Rose", stunned, thinking, "There's no hanky panky in the TARDIS! but how are they not going to?) that deepens through the series; Ten and Rose feel like high school sweethearts (I'll be honest, I thought at first they were trying so hard to make it an epic romance that that was going to be a plot point, that things really had changed after the regeneration, but I still thought that they were friends with benefits/partners-in-crime); with the Doctor/Master, it was such a product of the writing. They're all valid - in fact, they're kind of like a smorgasbord of "how to create or exploit chemistry".
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