GOP, abortion, rape

[noirem]

If you have no idea what I'm talking about read this firstI have tried to put into words my thoughts and feelings on the matter and I can't. I can tell you that I want to cry, that I want to throw up, that I am ashamed, and furious, but that's just surface chatter. I lean strongly towards pro-life, but I think the right to have one is just that - a

Comments

[ef2p]

We have marriage incentives (which don't work) - why don't we have parent incentives?

Actually there are some incentives in the tax code. Assuming a family with one working 'parent', you get as much of a deduction for a child as you do for a spouse. Plus there are a number of other deductions. For example, all those medical bills for pregnancy and birth, I'll bet that they will be enough to get the excessive medical expenses deduction. And if you do it right, you can deduct child care expenses. Of course you have to know how to navigate the tax code to do all that and our tax code is so complex that it frequently takes hiring an expert.

Of course tax deductions are a far cry for having it all paid for.

[noirem]

Tax breaks are fine if you can pay in the first place

[lyahdan]

No kidding. Telling someone looking at a hospital bill larger than multiple months of their salary "hey, it's a tax deduction," is not helpful. That deduction does not help buy food month to month, or shoes, or school supplies, etc.

Frankly, it's the same problem I have with the entire idea of the grandfather of H.R. 3, the Hyde Amendment. Basically, it says that we, as a society, think it's fine to say that only women with money should have options when they get pregnant. Both are particularly rude, given that the folks who vote for and agree with that statement also usually vote against the types of policy that would help those same women out with the costs of pregnancy and raising kids.

[yochannah]

First of all, thanks for the context, because I did have no idea

[superl99]

Nail on the head. Religious beliefs. They are a bane.

[borg9of9235]

This just reminded me of a very wise quote a technology in the sex industry journalist wrote: "I'm horrified by the assumption that, despite what we know of millennia of human behavior, teenagers are going to stop having sex because adults are telling them to."

I'm pro-choice, but mainly from a practicality standpoint. Abortions won't stop if they become illegal, they'll just become more dangerous. I too believe that we need to reduce the need for abortions. The fact that the US surgeon general who advocated condom education and masturbation as an alternative to teen sex was quickly and definitively fired for her views in favour of yet another idiot who advocated abstinence is just another example of the mentality that causes idiocy like this new bill.

[quen_elf]

(This is a UK perspective. I'm not familiar with the US system except to the extent that it's obviously insane and ridiculous in this area, but really, saying so is a bit fish-in-a-barrel, so not commenting on that specifically. I'm also going to sidetrack a lot from your concerns, but it's related

[superl99]

Yes.

[targaff]

I don't think there should be excessive support for raising children; especially not support that benefits the rich/middle income. Having children should continue to be a major sacrifice.

I mostly agree with this, but I wanted to point out that if by benefits you actually mean benefits, the belief that the benefits the rich/middle income populace gets (legally, anyway) as a result of having a child are of any meaningful significance is pure misguided ballyhoo. Certainly it's a drop in the ocean compared to the major sacrifice of, say, being able to afford just to live somewhere; and even setting that aside it's a drop in the ocean compared to the cost now likely to be incurred by the parents if, down the line, their child needs an education of the sort that you and I once benefited from getting for next to nothing.

[quen_elf]

Agree, I'm not suggesting the current government benefits for rich/middle income are remotely significant compared to the cost of raising a child.

I don't think economics i.e. punishing people financially is really an answer at all (if done to the extent that it would possibly work, the results in terms of child poverty, increasing inequality etc would be hideous). Improvements really have to come from a change in values. Unfortunately I don't think that is particularly likely but there we go.

[ribbin]

Thanks. I had no idea. That's horrendous.

Sometimes I'm ashamed to be American. I wish I didn't have reasons to be ashamed of my country.

I also wish this wasn't even something that needed to be talked about, but was simply assumed. Rape victims receive help, mothers receive help, people who wish not to become parents receive help.

Oh, wait, what am I saying, helping rape victims and mothers is socialism! I'm sorrrrrry, I didn't mean to be a Nazi!! *eyeroll*

[cest4chans]

I'm getting really tired of the government thinking they have a say in what goes on in my uterus or between me and my medical doctor of choice