Is There a Better Word Than Xenophobia?

Dec 05, 2010 00:08



Here's a YWN thread in which the idea that  "a Jewish child molester is on a higher level than Mother Theresa"  finds acceptance.

Lest you think that this opinion is one shared by a small, fringe group of nutjobs, almost every single self-identified Lubavitcher I have ever met espoused this idea without reserve. Here is one example. Chabad is far ( Read more... )

chosen nation, chabad, chassidim

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Comments 64

oneironstring December 6 2010, 04:28:44 UTC
Once I attended a "week of learning" in Crown Heights. I had paid a lot of money to travel across the country for it. Turns out, they cancelled it THE DAY BEFORE it was scheduled to begin, but I had already paid for my flights and such, so they said, come anyway and we will see what we can do to get you some l'arnin'.

I was treated to private lectures with rabbis who taught that gentiles have an animal soul and only Jews have a real soul. They knew that I was a geress. They must have known that I had family members I loved. They were all as nice as pie as they explained God's truth to me.

I used to feel closer to Chabad because, as others have said here, my local Chabad is loving and giving, but after my l'arnin', I realized that the locals probably harbor all these beliefs at the same time they put on a pleasant face. It is very discouraging to say the least.

You are probably uncomfortable answering this but I just have to ask -- where does your husband stand on all these things? How are you teaching your children?

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onionsoupmix December 6 2010, 12:56:50 UTC
My husband believes the party line. At best he will say that he doesn't really understand it, but he thinks the Tanya is sacred.

I have so far avoided teaching Tanya to my kids. There might come a time when they are expected to learn it. I'm not sure what I will do about that, but I guess I will cross that bridge when I get there.

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The heretic and her hubby vz85 December 16 2010, 04:01:13 UTC
Your household must be interesting.

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Thoughts on this article? anonymous December 6 2010, 05:58:51 UTC
Re: Thoughts on this article? onionsoupmix December 6 2010, 13:22:02 UTC
What concerns me is that there's almost no way to know what a shliach believes, unless you really force the issue. They may play down the topic, they may have other things to focus on, but at the end of the day I have yet to even hear of one shliach who would say something like "that portion of the Tanya reflects history and not the actual truth." The only person I could even imagine saying something like that would be Shmully Boteach and we all know what chabad thinks of him ( ... )

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Re: Thoughts on this article? anonymous December 6 2010, 14:58:32 UTC
I haven't ever studied Tanya, so I haven't asked the question. Bli neder, when we finally finish with lice, puking kids, snow, urgent client matters, year-end billing....I may find some time to look past Tanya lectures at my shul and try to find chapter 1 in English ( ... )

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Re: Thoughts on this article? onionsoupmix December 6 2010, 15:58:39 UTC

You are a Jewish Anti Semite anonymous December 6 2010, 09:34:35 UTC
Yawn. Who helped during Katrina and the Midwest flooding? Chabad. Who has the 7 Mitzvos Bnei Noach campaign? Chabad. Who operates rehab for non-Jews? Chabad.

What you are doing with that quote from Tanya, which is esoteric and refers only to souls of non Jews not having been on Sinai, is the same as what the neo-Nazis do with quotes from Gemara. Out of context, no explanation, just looking to shock people and uphold your own stupidity.

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Re: You are a Jewish Anti Semite onionsoupmix December 6 2010, 12:53:50 UTC
Yawn. I'm sure other groups some of whose members espouse hatred have also done some good. Chabad goes in to a catastrophe where Jews are involved or will be present. If there aren't any Jews, they don't go for the most part. It's not a kiruv or "look good for the media" chance.

As for the Tanya quote, is it esoteric? Who says? It's pretty simple- v'ein bohem tov klal. Their souls are made from impurity and there is no good in them whatsoever. This has nothing to do with souls not being at Sinai and I've never even heard this flavor of apologetics from anyone who has tried to explain this perek to me. Cite your source. Oh, and yes, please feel free to cite the entire first perek and explain how the context makes it any less vile.I have cited to the perek a gazillion times... http://www.chabad.org/library/tanya/tanya_cdo/aid/7880/jewish/Chapter-1.htm

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Re: You are a Jewish Anti Semite anonymous December 7 2010, 16:36:46 UTC
I read that thread if a Child molesting jew is greater than Mother Teresa

Just because SOME people belive that, doesnt mean its true

They have some crazy ideas there, Obama is Muslim. African Americans are racist

Jews own Hollywood and wall Street. The "Zionists" control Washington.

Gays are trying to pass the "Gay Agenda" and make everyone Gay.

All Hispanics are Illegal Ailens trying to take over this country, Ban English.

Its a Free country and you can belive whatever you want to

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Re: You are a Jewish Anti Semite onionsoupmix December 6 2010, 13:12:35 UTC
And if you actually discussed this with chabad people and children, you would have found that they agree with this idea, that the worst Jew is spiritually higher than the best gentile. Don't believe me, talk to them, ask them.

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Why this doesn't bother me anonymous December 9 2010, 04:17:21 UTC
I am a child giyores and am currently married to a Lubavitcher and now have some serious issues with Chabad philosophy*, however this isn't one of them ( ... )

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Re: Why this doesn't bother me onionsoupmix December 9 2010, 05:16:58 UTC
Thank you for your post. I will try to respond in detail.

These are inanimate (domem), vegetation (tzomeach), animals (chai), mdaber (humans), and klal Yisrael. It is quite clear to anyone looking at this that non-Jews are not considered subhuman.

To me, calling everyone other than the "in" group subhuman is not that far from calling the in group "uber-human" which is what your explanation assumes, that Jews are an entirely different entity.

My understanding of the first perek of Tanya is that the good that is being referred to here is goodness that comes with no form of ulterior motive whatsoever. Keep in mind that Tanya assigns very high standards to otherwise normal terms (like beinoni). Almost everyone has some kind of ulterior motive that is not 100% lshem shomayim when doing chessed, Jews included. These motives include satisfying ones inate desire to do kindness or to make one feel good about himself. The nefesh Elokis that a Jew has enables him to totally overcome his yetzer hara at the moment that he is doing chessed, ( ... )

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Re: Why this doesn't bother me anonymous December 9 2010, 13:26:22 UTC
HI,
I'm not the poster above but as far as I understand those spiritual differences are not so obvious that you can see and judge them and decide who's more selfless and who's selfless. It's on a completely different level, that we can't see.

L.

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Re: Why this doesn't bother me anonymous December 13 2010, 05:49:59 UTC
OSM - you write "his pshat is simple..", but from my brief reading of the first couple of chapters of Tanya, NONE of it has a simple, obvious meaning. See my previous comment about semen coming from the brain, for a example.

So, I can believe that either (1) the whole thing is rather crazy, thanks to some powerful mashke or funky mushrooms in Poland/Russia, or (2) it represents some sort of inspired spiritual message that defies any sort of "simple" understanding at all. [Or (3), it's an impressive intellectual work on spirituality written by someone who was literally surrounded by senseless Jew hatred on a constant basis.]

I thought I also saw something in your link about how the righteous among the nations are an exception, and that they too will do things strictly for the sake of goodness and not any ulterior motive.

JRKmommy

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vz85 December 16 2010, 05:05:45 UTC
How does this not bother anyone but me?
I'm curious as to how you dealt with it when you became a Chabadnik and learned all of these great beliefs. Were you initially enthusiastic about the idea? Did some set of circumstances cause you to rethink things? Did it always bother you ( ... )

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