staying walk

[reallyfled]

It is an interesting thing when people say, "I found Jesus..."
- "I didn't realize He was lost"...

which opens up a whole plethora of truth to be mentioned about the subject of salvation... do you know where this is going?

Comments

[noright_angles]

Kind of...

It's really good to have you back.

[tinydove]

i'm going to be honest. i see what you mean when you say that. however, to lend any light i may on the aubject, i see the phrase cast quite differently. when people say "i found Jesus," it's not to say that Jesus was lost or not there to begin with. instead, it's to say that they found Jesus in a point of need. people seek and seek and struggle and fight to find deity, or a connection with any higher power that provides hope for their mortal souls. finding Jesus is more of an earthly realization that He was there all along, and that perhaps the person just learned to truly open their eyes and invite Him in. from that point, the change occurs in that they now know how to connect to the Lifesource and they (hopefully) begin to live a life that is pleasing to Him.

you may think i am totaly wrong, but that's how i see it.

[tinydove]

ugh.

totally*

[reallyfled]

Oh yeah- I see what you are saying, but that isn't Biblically correct. Throughout the Bible, from beginning to end, it makes it a very strong point that we are inherently evil, we have nothing in and of us to search for Christ (or find Him). Whenever we "find" Christ, it is He who calls us, the elect, through an effectual calling. All of this is laid out very nicely in the first, eh... 7 (I think) chapters of Romans.

So, I understand what you are saying again- it is the sort of thing that people normally talk about. But coming from a logician's and philosopher's perspective- coming from a true and genuine perspective, it is not appropriate to use words however you want, and say that it doesn't matter. It does matter, what you are meaning to say is not what you are saying. To watch that sort of fallacy propagate without trying to educate otherwise is a mistake on the part of those who know and a furtherance of ignorance on the part of the ones "fallacying".

[myruinedhands]

it should be noted that it is a valid (albeit open to debate, as are most all things..) interpretation that when the Bible refers to the elect, it is referring to a class, not individuals. this then could show that election is "not God’s choice of a restricted number of individuals whom he wills to save but the description of that corporate body which, in Christ, He is saving."

just saying.

[reallyfled]

Oh, now we are getting into methods of predestination. What you are saying is that double predestination doesn't exist- which, I agree with.