Or should I be making the switch to transgender people instead of transgendered people? What do you say, personally, and why?
I don't like transgendered because it's not consistent with how we describe people of other genders. Someone is a man, not a manned person. I also don't like the passive construction. Who is doing the transgendering of me, and why? Did I just sit around while it all happened?
I prefer transgender, not that I particularly use it to describe myself. *shrug* If I have to, I'll say transgender man, transsexual man, trans man, but while I am medically transsexual, as far as my gender is concerned I'm pretty comfortable just being a man.
These are true. But for someone reason, it hasn't stuck with me. I mean, the explanations resonate, but the usage hasn't shifted for me.
::nod:: As far as my gender goes, I'm not a man, but I'm not "in between" I'm something else. I'm not even sure what that is, but I don't have to be. I just am.
I tend not to use transgender at all in relation to myself, I feel like transsexual is more accurate. When talking about other people I tend to just say trans people to avoid the issue entirely (and to include people like myself who don't find the word transgender resonates). I must say, I hate 'transmasculine'. In reference to me, I mean. Conflates a lot of things that aren't really that similar.
While we're on the topic, can we talk about transpeople (all one word) and the even worse transfolk (all one word)?
I abhor "he's a transgender." But we were transitioning at about the same time back in the day (insert fond memories of y-g here), so you know, common culture at least back then. I would use "transgendered" but more commonly I use "trans" or "trans*" to avoid the whole question (plus the transsexual vs transgendered one).
I have the sense that it's more common usage in the MTF community than the FTM, but I'm not the most in touch with the current scene & have been more in FTM circles than MTF.
Truthfully, after someone tried to call me an elder of the community since I transitioned 10 years ago, I've been a little freaked out - surely we're too young to be elders!
I dunno. I think there's a cultural moment of transitioning pre-2000 and post. I often use Boys Don't Cry as the marker, but it is not the cause, more of a cultural zeitgeist that I was on the far side of, but just barely.
So, uh, not exactly an elder, but I get why people have said and think that about me.
I was just saying to someone else this morning - RIP True Spirit, so I will add, RIP young-guys circa 1998/1999/2000.
kids these days.. It's been interesting getting the 10 years later perspective. I follow jcalanthe's usage with trans* or trans (as in trans person|people|man|woman) as an adjective. But i find "X is a trans" and "X is a transgender" weird/offensive. FWIW, I used to ID as transmasculine, but I don't anymore. I've been noticing more of a split between transgender and transsexual these days.
I don't think it matters. I use either (in the adjective form, not the noun form. I use that difference as a however-rough demarcation of how much one may or may not know abt TG people). zevinboots has a good point that the "-ed" implies that someone is "transgendering" one, but that's the only difference I can see
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as an ally (or at least a hopeful ally)frecklestarsDecember 9 2009, 20:36:38 UTC
I find the construction "he is a transgender" exceedingly odd-sounding. I've never heard it used. It sounds like saying "oh he's a gay" - that just sounds _wrong_ to me. Like, negative wrong. On the other hand, I hear transgendered as an adjective used a lot and have not heard anyone be uncomfortable with it. Transmasculine is another word I've heard used, and I like the sound of it equally as well as transgendered.
My suspicion is that using transmasculine vs transgendered is a personal preference thing. I'm more than happy to use whichever term (or another entirely) that the individual is most comfortable with. The right to describe oneself precisely is really important.
Re: as an ally (or at least a hopeful ally)rexlezardDecember 9 2009, 20:57:35 UTC
So you don't like transgender, either?
Some trans people are really big on transgender, and I'm just not sure if I am being a fuddy-duddy curmudgeon or if I should change my ways, or if it even matters.
I think transgender v. transgendered is more or less a style issue, though I tend to agree with Zevinboots. There has been a large shift in language use around trans* stuff in the last ten years, so maybe the era of your transition has something to do with it.
I used to like transmasculine, but then I had it (correctly, I think) pointed out that it tends to reinforce the impression that trans man = ueber butch and ignores the fact that there are femme trans men and others who may be male identified but not masculine. Not to mention butch trans women - woman does not indicate feminine obvs.
The "a transgender" usage makes me crazy and when used by a cis person nearly always indicates to me that if I stick around long enough they'll say something fucked up. Trans* is an adjective, not a noun, afaiac.
On the whole, I do see myself as part of a transmasculine community that does include (some) butches. Less a continuum with trans men just the other side of Butch with a capital B, and more a Venn diagramme.
I wrote a paper called Venn and the Art of Gender Maintenance, about the policing of boundaries in order to maintain distinctly gendered categories among trans men/transmasculine people/FTMs/butches.
I just think it's problematic to claim masculinity for a group of people when many of them don't claim it for themselves, and when it leaves in the cold others who do claim it.
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I don't like transgendered because it's not consistent with how we describe people of other genders. Someone is a man, not a manned person. I also don't like the passive construction. Who is doing the transgendering of me, and why? Did I just sit around while it all happened?
I prefer transgender, not that I particularly use it to describe myself. *shrug* If I have to, I'll say transgender man, transsexual man, trans man, but while I am medically transsexual, as far as my gender is concerned I'm pretty comfortable just being a man.
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::nod:: As far as my gender goes, I'm not a man, but I'm not "in between" I'm something else. I'm not even sure what that is, but I don't have to be. I just am.
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That's pretty much what I was gonna say.
I tend not to use transgender at all in relation to myself, I feel like transsexual is more accurate. When talking about other people I tend to just say trans people to avoid the issue entirely (and to include people like myself who don't find the word transgender resonates). I must say, I hate 'transmasculine'. In reference to me, I mean. Conflates a lot of things that aren't really that similar.
While we're on the topic, can we talk about transpeople (all one word) and the even worse transfolk (all one word)?
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I have the sense that it's more common usage in the MTF community than the FTM, but I'm not the most in touch with the current scene & have been more in FTM circles than MTF.
Truthfully, after someone tried to call me an elder of the community since I transitioned 10 years ago, I've been a little freaked out - surely we're too young to be elders!
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So, uh, not exactly an elder, but I get why people have said and think that about me.
I was just saying to someone else this morning - RIP True Spirit, so I will add, RIP young-guys circa 1998/1999/2000.
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I've been noticing more of a split between transgender and transsexual these days.
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Clearly not; I mean, that's the most concrete or literal difference I can see.
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My suspicion is that using transmasculine vs transgendered is a personal preference thing. I'm more than happy to use whichever term (or another entirely) that the individual is most comfortable with. The right to describe oneself precisely is really important.
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Some trans people are really big on transgender, and I'm just not sure if I am being a fuddy-duddy curmudgeon or if I should change my ways, or if it even matters.
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Not really. It just sounds...bizarre. But if someone wishes to be referred to as such, I'm more than happy to do so.
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I used to like transmasculine, but then I had it (correctly, I think) pointed out that it tends to reinforce the impression that trans man = ueber butch and ignores the fact that there are femme trans men and others who may be male identified but not masculine. Not to mention butch trans women - woman does not indicate feminine obvs.
The "a transgender" usage makes me crazy and when used by a cis person nearly always indicates to me that if I stick around long enough they'll say something fucked up. Trans* is an adjective, not a noun, afaiac.
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I wrote a paper called Venn and the Art of Gender Maintenance, about the policing of boundaries in order to maintain distinctly gendered categories among trans men/transmasculine people/FTMs/butches.
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