The Subtle Hand of Awesome

[rob_donoghue]

I'm a big fan of the Birthright setting that TSR put out back in the day. It hit a lot of notes I really liked - the world felt populated, politics had a powerful role, monsters felt mythic - it just rocked. But one subtle note always impressed me. In one of the nations of the game, the default one detailed in the core book, the High King's

Comments

[bryant]

I have a level 4 LFR Str-based cleric. Divine Power was not as much of a boost as I'd hoped, but it's a significant boost. Recovery Strike is very important, since it's a second good Str-based at-will. Whoever wrote the cleric powers definitely had some Str-cleric experience and filled in the holes I wanted to see filled.

Wis-based is the better healer. On the other hand, in a melee-oriented party, there is nothing but good things to be said about offering your friend +4 to hit on a regular basis.

I'd still like to see Cleric redesigned.

[rob_donoghue]

I may be giving the powers short shrift, I admit. I was mostly struck by the disparity among the paragon paths.

[bryant]

Oh, yeah. The paragon paths are rather depressing.

There's a subtle tricky problem in there: Strength cleric paragon paths have to be better than Pit Fighter. But it could have been solved in ways other than the marking emphasis.

Hm, I ought to pick up my thoughts on a Strength cleric Dragon article.

[samldanach]

There are a few tricky bits to that approach, though, from a writer's perspective (I realize that I'm now the choir preaching to the preacher here, but

[rob_donoghue]

This is part of the reason I really feel like setting (and by extension, adventure design) is the red-headed stepchild of game design. There have been some really solid innovations, but they have been strongly outpaced by the focus on rules and such. Add to this the desirability of creating IP which can be used to create novels, video games and such, (as well as the growth of "our world, but..." Setting design) and it's not hard to see why setting doesn't get the love it deserves.

[samldanach]

I think that one of the other reasons that setting design continues to flail rather than proceeding is that too many people keep trying to apply principles from writing. Developing a good setting for a novel or film is not remotely the same as developing a good setting for an RPG. Well, there are some lessons that carry over, but they are mostly the basic ones (make it engaging, throwaway lines do a lot to extend the setting in the mind of the reader/viewer, keep it consistent

Solomon's judgement

[samldanach]

My own take, as a procrastinating champion who spends far too much time designing and far too little GMing is as follows

[srhall79]

I would really love to see the Cleric, Paladin, Warlock and Warlord (ESPECIALLY the Warlord) retooled based on the lessons learned so farOne of these things is not like the others

[drivingblind]

Warlords have a stat-split path to their power progressions.

[rob_donoghue]

The warlord has a stat-split problem, but not to the same extent of the other classes. As you note, it's more threaded in with his abilities. However, the reason I want to see it retooled is simple: I conceptually love the warlord, and I feel like it falls down in play. I know it's fixable, because everytime I see a bard in action, I feel like I'm watching an upgrade on the Warlord.

[srhall79]

Hmm. Now I want to see a bard in action. Warlords have worked out pretty well for my group, but the highest one we've seen is level 9. I wonder if the effectiveness will continue through paragon.

Considering the PHB2 classes and the artificer, I do think warlords come dead last in healing ability. I think that's what I'm most concerned with for later levels.

[joshroby]

Have you ever looked at Tribe 8, Rob? There's a lot of very large PC-shaped holes in that game. And the kicker is, the PC-shaped holes are much bigger than the PCs start out as, not just in terms of power but also in terms of... emotional maturity, for lack of a better term. Not only does it map out a couple exits for PCs, but it puts a challenging bar to entry across them. It's very exciting and cool.

[rechan]

I agree with you about the Warlord, and to a lesser extent, the Warlock.

However, an interesting note. I've found some people online who really, really think the Warlord is one of the strongest classes. Purely based on mathmatics. For instance there was a power in Martial Power - something Gambit - that let the Warlord grant a player a second turn as a minor action. This was "the most powerful utility in the game" untiol it was Erratad. Apparently the Tactical Warlord can stack up insane amounts of bonuses and such, from what I hear professed.

But it's got no style and no heart to it. It's just number crunching strength.