Do we exist after death?
From a post over on the LJ Community abstractthought, posted by dierdrae
quote: "Do we have actual evidence for our belief..."
No matter what "evidence" one would offer, there is another that would deny it, and that, based upon the lack of actual proof for either point of view. It come down to individual belief. Proponents of all sides of the question utilize "faith". One either believes that there is or that there is not,( or takes a middle stand saying, “I just don’t know”.
Agnostic, in the Greek, a=no; gnosis=knowledge), {Thomas Huxley is given the credit for creating this word}.
[The following “quotes” are from the original post & responses on the LJ Community mentioned above.]
quote: "Neuroscientists think they have consciousness all figured out"
The word "think" here could be substituted by "Assume". As long as we believe that there is no proof either way, we must each assume that, which we choose to believe, taking it as our personal truth.
quote: "Near death experiences are hallucinations, as are ghosts and other paranormal experiences, and even the feeling of a religious experience can be stimulated by electrodes."
Artificial Stimulation can cause a myriad of `experiences'. We have documented proof of PCP usage in the 60's, where one could suffer severe trauma internally, and continue to move, react and even perform actions (feats of strength) that the non-stimulated person would not be able to bear or do, because of the extremes of pain from the injuries.
Any “Artificial Stimulation”, be it intervenes, by mouth or external (such as electric shock), physical or mental trauma, or self-induced mental anguish, may well bring about visions or hallucinatory experiences that seem “real”, yet we are returned again to our original premise without actual, acceptable proof.
quote: “Matter and energy are not lost, merely transformed. Our bodies are formed from the ash of ancient stars that exploded and scattered their remnants across the cosmos, and here we are, made of carbon and oxygen and a dab of hydrogen ..."
I couldn’t resist a bit of humor here :o)
Ashes to Ashes,
Dust to Dust.
What the Sun don't bleach
The Rain will rust!
W. V. Kahler
quote: "Scientists don't know what consciousness is objectively."
quote: "I often wonder if the next time the energy that compromises me is used to form something else living, would that be me?"
quote: "(B)ut then to go even more abstract, am I solely the energy that compromises me? I might be much larger than I originally think, I might also be that rock, that tree, that bird"
So then, if when I die, my body returns to dust and the Physical Atoms that I am, return to the soil, (some of which becomes mixed with other Atoms), we must wonder if my consciousness (accepting for the sake of argument, that Consciousness is physical), remains physical or becomes ethereal. Can a physical thing exist in space, in or outside of time? Can a physical consciousness exist outside of a physical body?
If it is physical, then we take that matter with us, to wherever it is that we then exist. If that matter, is ethereal (that is, without physical substance), then we arrive at a basic question:
Do we cease to exist, completely or do we enter a dimension, a plane, a realm of existence totally beyond anything physical?
Here I come to a question brought to mind by years reading and participating in Internet discussions between the Evolutionist and the Creationist.
They both agree that some "thing" always existed.
For the Evolutionist, that thing that had no beginning, spontaneously transformed into life as we know it.
For the Creationist, that "thing" that had no beginning, was an Intelligence that created life as we know it.
The both seem to agree that there has always been “something” that existed, without a beginning.
If the starting point of “life” was not Intelligence, then I would believe that when I die, that is the end of all, for me.
If I hold to an Intelligent Designer, than I would find the hope of life beyond physical death.
So then, we have reached no point of proof on either side of the argument. We remain as we were, caught in a loop, each of us still left to make our own choice.
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Which brings me to a related subject for further or future Abstract Thinking (and somewhat covered by several episodes of Star Trek DSN with Picard and Q):
In all of vast and endless Space, is it possible that other Beings exist:
As pure energy?
As beings of pure thought?
As beings without physical bodies?
Could such Beings exist outside of Time?
Could they be capable of creating physical life?
Just as we live in (or are surrounded by) Oxygen and at the same moment, Oxygen exists inside us, could there be Beings without physical existence, occupying all of space and at the same moment, all of space, existing within them…
Tough concept to get my brain to wrap around… but oh do I love the Suppositional Argument, the “What If’s” and the Esoteric, Cryptic challenges of Abstract Thinking! :o)