O fandom. O my late lamented innocence.

[spinrabbit]

In the struggles the sf congoer (and nerd-con more broadly) communities have been going through recently over sexual harassment, the late Isaac Asimov's predilection for nonconsensual groping comes up pretty frequently -- notably here: Read more... )

Comments

[woodwardiocom]

I suspect my favorite authors (and other creators) are divided into two categories: Those whose problematic behaviors and beliefs I know about, and those where I simply haven't done the necessary research yet. Lovecraft was a racist, Asimov was a groper, Heinlein was a libertarian hawk with no ability to write about women or poly, McCaffery has some really weird ideas about homosexuality, Tolkien's bad guys all suspiciously resemble people of color, Chaucer was likely a rapist, Muhammad married a 7-year old, Jefferson owned slaves.

I can't really excuse these things, but I recognize that greatness can exist in the same person as the things I despise.

[browngirl]

Mrmn. I figure you mean this as a consolation, but when people express this sentiment to me it tends to sound like a minimization of the harm that has been done. I've seen people describe being groped by Asimov, including being held down by fellow congoers to give him access -- how much excellent writing excuses that?

[woodwardiocom]

how much excellent writing excuses that?

I said "I can't really excuse these things." I believe we're on the same page, there.

[browngirl]

Except that you bely that phrase with the minimizing message of the comment surrounding it -- that's what I'm trying to point out to you, in hope that that is not your intent.

[browngirl]

I could have written this post, but you wrrote it better than I could have. I so completely hear you. :(

[lyonesse]

in general i agree with you, but on an individual basis you might have got lucky?

asimov groped me at my parents' house when i was about six (they knew each other socially, through mensa i suspect). i hated him.

on the other hand, harlan ellison -- whom i believe to be a pretty lousy human being after all -- once lent me money to call my mom at a con in new york city, and was entirely civilized and kind.

[ron_newman]

Oy, that's horrifying. I'm so sorry to hear that this happened to you!

[lyonesse]

eh, it was okay. i hit him. my parents attempted to make social amends, but i thought fairness had been achieved. i'm not sure he liked me after that either.

[browngirl]

I'm glad you were and are okay (and continue to be impressed with you), but I'm still mad that he did that to anyone (if that makes sense). Ergh.

I should hope that if anyone does that to the children in my care I don't fall into the reflexive 'social amends' conditioning that so often leads people to deprioritize those who have been infringed upon.