All of this. Just, yes. As a writer of original fiction, I don't believe one should completely cater to readers/viewers--BUT one should keep them in mind, ESPECIALLY if you're lucky enough to get a decently sized following.
Consideration for the fanbase could be as simple as remembering we're there when promoting the show. Maybe RTD should take his own advice and watch Supernatural. To clarify Eric Kripke (the excitative producer/head writer of Supernatural) has said that whilst Supernatural is his show and he's going to tell the story he wants, he still listens to the fans, plus Kripke knows how to create drama without killing off most of the cast, and your comment reminded me of that.
Um, no idea how I got here (just got myself a new mouse and it all but checks out the entire internet on its own, really), but anyway.
Yes, I think writers and producers and networks and actors should somehow keep fans of a show in mind. Althought fans are the of the iceberg, and thus only a small part of the viewing audience, an iceberg sort of needs that top.
But, personally, I'm still right there on that top. I'm even way more higher than I was before CoE. I've always been a fan of TW, but for me, CoE was sort of RTD finally keeping his promise of making Jack's own series the best series ever.
I cried a lot after Day 4 and I've cried through Day 5, but it was such brilliant tv, I just couldn't stay angry at RTD. I absolutely loved it. For me, it was bigger and better.
And I know that I'm not the only fan who feels like that. So, part of fandom feels let down, part of fandom feels they were finally give what they wanted. It's not that RTD turned his back on the whole of fandom.
You have a good point. I have to confess I wrote this out of the mindset resulting from a long discussion with people who seemed to have feelings similar about it to mine, and didn't remember to think about how the fans who did like it fit into all of it.
So, I'm really not sure what to think of my half-assed rant if I take into account the fans who did like it. I'd like to ask if you felt that all the characterizations were consistent with the two previous series first of all.
"So, I'm really not sure what to think of my half-assed rant if I take into account the fans who did like it. I'd like to ask if you felt that all the characterizations were consistent with the two previous series first of all."
Jack, yes. Ianto, dunno, he seemed less secure. But in my personal canon, the two of them just started living together which makes him a bit nervous. And hence the 'moving in' celebration in the restaurant and hence the whole 'couple' stuff.
Gwen I thought wasn't consistent with S1 and S2. But, weird enough, in a good way. I absolutely hated Gwen, and during CoE I began to like her. And that was weird.
Thanks for saying this. I've been accumulating responses from outside the fandom bubble, and so far not one of them, even my most Ianto-loving friends, shares the anger I've read in the comms.
Generally they've been extremely impressed with the writing/acting and direction and felt that there was the possibility for a Torchwood S4, and that they'd be interested in seeing it.
I know that writers can't try to please fandom at every turn, and even if they did try, it would be impossible, because fandom is not a monolithic entity. But, when you do make a decision that you MUST know will be extremely unpopular with your fandom, I think it's poor form to berate your fandom for reacting negatively to that, especially when the show was promoted as something VERY different to what we actually got.
I feel like perhaps it goes beyond reacting to reactions. Like there was an element of punishing fans for being fans in the first place, which RTD is a very good position to do, because he knows what fans like and want.
Yeah... it's sort of like this attitude that we have an obligation to be grateful for CoE, even if we found it a horrible experience.
I saw on the discussion over at curriejean's place that you were discussion fandom and fic as a sort of pseudo-religious experience, and I think this ties into that a bit as well. It's sort of like, as fans, we're supposed to have a very Judeo-Christian approach to show's creator as God, and therefore we should be grateful for everything, even things that hurt us: "Rusty giveth and Rusty taketh away, blessed be the name of Rusty." It's like we're required to have this absolute faith that the creators are doing the right thing, or we're somehow overstepping our bounds as fans
( ... )
Then you don't see the flowers and the coffee as fans acting in spite of "the Word of God" (as they actually call it on TVtropes!)?
Then again, perhaps it is how you describe it. I'm not among those who've left flowers or sent coffee, so I'm not in a position to know firsthand.
I imagine the public mourning of fans must be pissing them off. (Well, don't RTD's comments about it indicate as much?) I'm curious to see if can continue and grow to the point that there'll be some fallout--a backlash from the show creators. Or perhaps a backdown from the BBC.
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Maybe RTD should take his own advice and watch Supernatural. To clarify Eric Kripke (the excitative producer/head writer of Supernatural) has said that whilst Supernatural is his show and he's going to tell the story he wants, he still listens to the fans, plus Kripke knows how to create drama without killing off most of the cast, and your comment reminded me of that.
Reply
Yes, I think writers and producers and networks and actors should somehow keep fans of a show in mind. Althought fans are the of the iceberg, and thus only a small part of the viewing audience, an iceberg sort of needs that top.
But, personally, I'm still right there on that top. I'm even way more higher than I was before CoE. I've always been a fan of TW, but for me, CoE was sort of RTD finally keeping his promise of making Jack's own series the best series ever.
I cried a lot after Day 4 and I've cried through Day 5, but it was such brilliant tv, I just couldn't stay angry at RTD. I absolutely loved it. For me, it was bigger and better.
And I know that I'm not the only fan who feels like that. So, part of fandom feels let down, part of fandom feels they were finally give what they wanted. It's not that RTD turned his back on the whole of fandom.
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So, I'm really not sure what to think of my half-assed rant if I take into account the fans who did like it. I'd like to ask if you felt that all the characterizations were consistent with the two previous series first of all.
Reply
Jack, yes. Ianto, dunno, he seemed less secure. But in my personal canon, the two of them just started living together which makes him a bit nervous. And hence the 'moving in' celebration in the restaurant and hence the whole 'couple' stuff.
Gwen I thought wasn't consistent with S1 and S2. But, weird enough, in a good way. I absolutely hated Gwen, and during CoE I began to like her. And that was weird.
And Andy and Rhys were fabulous as ever.
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Generally they've been extremely impressed with the writing/acting and direction and felt that there was the possibility for a Torchwood S4, and that they'd be interested in seeing it.
Reply
I know that writers can't try to please fandom at every turn, and even if they did try, it would be impossible, because fandom is not a monolithic entity. But, when you do make a decision that you MUST know will be extremely unpopular with your fandom, I think it's poor form to berate your fandom for reacting negatively to that, especially when the show was promoted as something VERY different to what we actually got.
Reply
I feel like perhaps it goes beyond reacting to reactions. Like there was an element of punishing fans for being fans in the first place, which RTD is a very good position to do, because he knows what fans like and want.
Reply
I saw on the discussion over at curriejean's place that you were discussion fandom and fic as a sort of pseudo-religious experience, and I think this ties into that a bit as well. It's sort of like, as fans, we're supposed to have a very Judeo-Christian approach to show's creator as God, and therefore we should be grateful for everything, even things that hurt us: "Rusty giveth and Rusty taketh away, blessed be the name of Rusty." It's like we're required to have this absolute faith that the creators are doing the right thing, or we're somehow overstepping our bounds as fans ( ... )
Reply
Then again, perhaps it is how you describe it. I'm not among those who've left flowers or sent coffee, so I'm not in a position to know firsthand.
I imagine the public mourning of fans must be pissing them off. (Well, don't RTD's comments about it indicate as much?) I'm curious to see if can continue and grow to the point that there'll be some fallout--a backlash from the show creators. Or perhaps a backdown from the BBC.
Reply
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