Fuel miles and eco-protectionism

[subtle_eye]

People who automatically equate purchasing domestically produced with environmentally friendly make me angry. Partially because it commingles something I love about progressive politics (Environmentalism) with something I detest (Protectionism, tariffs, anti-trade

Comments

[pyrrha17]

While I certainly try to buy imported rice, I refuse to buy canned tomatoes all the way from Italy. They're grown right here and packed in Shepparton - our farmers also need supporting!

[nclean]

See comment below.

Why do our farmers need supporting?

[ingysledge]

My problem with buying locally is when the produce is not one that should be grown here. For example: there are parts of Australia where rice could be grown without too much hassle (e.g. the tropical, high rainfall areas). Why anyone thinks that growing rice in the rest of Australia is a good idea is beyond me.

[etfb]

I quite like the theory that rice is grown out Griffith way because it's the right colour to hide the large marijuana plantations so they can't be spotted from the air...

(No idea if it's true, but it's a theory.)

[iki_maska]

They grow pot in old water tanks or under orange trees to make near infra-red detection hard/impossible. Dudes near Tumut were sprug when the authorities investigated a bright green patch in the middle of a dry brown hillside, you can still see residual brightness over 5 years later.

[iki_maska]

You'll love this book. I've been touting this to everyone who's interested in energy policy. http://www.withouthotair.com/... )

[iki_maska]

One thing I have thought about is that higher food prices (i.e. ones reflecting energy cost) would have a number of benefits. Land here might be more valuable for production rather than coastal sprawl. More people might grow and buy locally. The food imported from 3rd world countries might earn more profit. Less money is spent on creating CO2.

Not all US farmers get subsidies. It's pretty much corn, soy, sugar, cotton and a few other cartels. It's good to thick through a number of options on how we might be able to change thing.

[subtle_eye]

The appendix is well researched, but also horrifically frustrating as a reference.

It's very nice to know that gas produces 66% as much CO2/kWh when compared to coal if you're making heat, unfortunately it's completely *useless* for working out transport CO2 emissions, as most transportation uses litres of fuel, not kWh.

[sly_girl]

I think you need to factor in the cost of getting it on the boat. Overseas products are not produced at the port. They need to be transported - by those very carbon costly trucks - overland before they even get on to the boat. The cost of shipping stuff overseas is an additional cost to land transport costs, not an alternative.

Further, once it has arrived from overseas, the stuff still has to be packed on to trucks to get it places within Australia. Unfortunately, all those carbon debits don't just disappear.

[mordwen]

Interesting point, thanks...

It's factored ...

[subtle_eye]

... and not mentioned because it's proportionately negligible.

Most of what I'm personally fulminating against is the reactionary "oh noes! teh food miles!" that I see far too much of instead of engagement with the real issues.

The cost of food transportation -- and the ensuing carbon is close to invisible in our society ... the "drive down to the shop and buy a litre of milk, luv?" attitude. Is the farmer in the developing world saving to educate his kids likely to be so laissez-faire about the cost of transporting his livelihood to the point of sale? I don't think so.

[sly_girl]

Well ... you claim that it's negligible. I think you're mistaken.

It's not the farmer in the developing country who's getting the stuff on the boat. The farmer in the developing country is not the one transporting the stuff 300km to the nearest sea port. It's not getting there by mule train, it's being driven. In trucks.

It's cheaper than the cost of transport at this end so it makes economic sense to do so but the carbon cost is just as much. It uses just as much fuel, but because you're paying bugger all to the growers and driver in SE Asia, your rice costs less.

There are arguments to be made where you touch on developing economies and markets, but I don't think your fuel costs add up.

[iki_maska]

Growing rice or cotton in Australia is fine as long as there's nothing distorting the purchase of inputs like water. User pays...