First Day Back -- Banned!
Until minutes ago I had been a member of an LJ community called WoW_Ladies. It was, back when I first joined, a nice place for people to discuss World of Warcraft, mostly out of character.
Earlier today, I replied to a thread talking about sexism in the game. The premise was that the game designers had, perhaps unintentionally, created a male-centric world. That the fact that most of the non-player character movers and shakers in the game were male, lent the feel that women were inferiour.
The discussion proposed that if a person grows up thinking that men are more capable than women, that person will unconsciously place greater importance on men. And, that outlets such as children's programming and "E" rated games could perpetuate this by displaying men in more capable positions.
I posted a suggestion which I admitted was unlikely to happen, but thought it might spark interesting discussion. I suggested that Blizzard allow players to retire PCs to become NPCs. Perhaps in exchange for a few months free game play. This way, the gender leanings of the community as a whole would direct the male to female ratio of prominent NPCs. The game could grow and evolve with current NPC leaders dying off in a patch to be replaced by a former PC.
The first reply I got was strongly, but vaguely, against it. It said that the players were 10000x worse than the designers. I took this to mean that the replier believed that the high numbers of gold farmers (people who play to gather in-game rewards to sell for out of game cash), griefers (people who have fun by disrupting other people's play), or adolescents. I further developed my idea by saying that Blizzard could limit the submissions to main or high level alts. The reward of free game play wouldn't appeal to adolescents who have their accounts paid for by family, and the gold farmers wouldn't be able to submit a character or else expose themselves as gold farmers.
Her next reply was, "Still terrible."
I asked her why it was terrible.
She said because she would rather the game designers stop being sexist.
To this, I pointed out that the initial premise was that the designers were not doing this by intent or with malice, but by ignorance due to the way they may have been raised. I said that going back in time to change how they were raised was not practical, nor would firing them all and hiring new designers in the hopes that they didn't have a male-centric world view. I asked her if she actually had a reason for declaring my idea terrible, or if she was just dismissing it because I, a person who hasn't posted to the community for months and wasn't an active participant before that, suggested it.
She asked me if I was trying to say, "Boo hoo, you called me a name and don't like my awesome idea."
And, the mod locked the thread.
So, I messaged her to say that, no, I was not saying that at all. I was just asking why she disagreed. Could she provide any reason at all, because I was honestly interested. The graduation of PCs to NPCs is something that was done in Living City, something that was planned but I don't think ever realized in Living Greyhawk, and could someday be an issue in Fellowship. I wanted honest feedback.
Now, I will admit that my attempt to get discussion blinded me to the possibility that she was simply objecting for the sake of objection. Maybe she didn't have a reason, but just wanted to see how long she could drag out the thread. I even wondered if maybe that was the reason the thread was locked.
After lunch, I saw her reply. Her contentious, rambling, and non-sequitorish reply. And, I also got a message from the moderator saying I was removed. But, not why. I tried to message her back and found that I'd been banned from the community.
I guess I could also point out that the community rules state that there is a three strike process to getting banned? I had no strikes, straight to banned. I assume for sending the private message, which I will agree is in many communities disallowed. It isn't addressed in the Wow_Ladies rules, though. If it had been, I'd have just ignored the person and let it drop. But, since she directly asked me a question which cast me in an uncomfortable light, I replied.
I'm posting the letter I wrote to the moderator here, because I wrote it and don't want it to go to waste. I don't think that anyone on my f-list came here from WoW-Ladies, and if so please know that I'm not trying to besmirch the community or the moderator, or even the person who was baiting me. I'm just getting an annoyance off of my chest.
Kryptongirl,
I guess I didn't realize Wow_Ladies had changed so much in the months while I was away.
To be clear, Reservoir baited and (I now believe) trolled me. She privately messaged me to say that I was "crazy, creepy, disgusting, and cannot read". And, I am the one banned? Upon my first posts returning?
I suppose I could be misreading the subject line. But, I somehow doubt it.
I am hoping you can tell me what I did which was, "aggressive, sexist, or otherwise cause the members ... to feel threatened or uncomfortable." Because, if it was replying to her question, I will understand what kind of community this has become and will gladly remove myself from it.
I will also point out that I began my reply, thusly.
"Now, I understand that the mod closed the thread. And, it may be a breach of etiquette that I message you. I want you to know that I only do so to answer the question you asked."
In other words, as apologetic and non-threatening as possible while still answering the question she directly put toward me.
Should I have just ignored her? I now believe that I should have, as I now believe she was simply trolling me. But, I know that any community has people who go out of their way to harass and annoy other members. I am simply asking if the mods are no longer fair.
Theno
PS, I would have replied to your message to me, but couldn't.
Since the message couldn't be sent, I am assuming that my answer is, "No, the mods are not fair."
Not a great return to LJ. But, hey, one less community on my list.
Maybe I should go through and cut out some others.
Theno
Earlier today, I replied to a thread talking about sexism in the game. The premise was that the game designers had, perhaps unintentionally, created a male-centric world. That the fact that most of the non-player character movers and shakers in the game were male, lent the feel that women were inferiour.
The discussion proposed that if a person grows up thinking that men are more capable than women, that person will unconsciously place greater importance on men. And, that outlets such as children's programming and "E" rated games could perpetuate this by displaying men in more capable positions.
I posted a suggestion which I admitted was unlikely to happen, but thought it might spark interesting discussion. I suggested that Blizzard allow players to retire PCs to become NPCs. Perhaps in exchange for a few months free game play. This way, the gender leanings of the community as a whole would direct the male to female ratio of prominent NPCs. The game could grow and evolve with current NPC leaders dying off in a patch to be replaced by a former PC.
The first reply I got was strongly, but vaguely, against it. It said that the players were 10000x worse than the designers. I took this to mean that the replier believed that the high numbers of gold farmers (people who play to gather in-game rewards to sell for out of game cash), griefers (people who have fun by disrupting other people's play), or adolescents. I further developed my idea by saying that Blizzard could limit the submissions to main or high level alts. The reward of free game play wouldn't appeal to adolescents who have their accounts paid for by family, and the gold farmers wouldn't be able to submit a character or else expose themselves as gold farmers.
Her next reply was, "Still terrible."
I asked her why it was terrible.
She said because she would rather the game designers stop being sexist.
To this, I pointed out that the initial premise was that the designers were not doing this by intent or with malice, but by ignorance due to the way they may have been raised. I said that going back in time to change how they were raised was not practical, nor would firing them all and hiring new designers in the hopes that they didn't have a male-centric world view. I asked her if she actually had a reason for declaring my idea terrible, or if she was just dismissing it because I, a person who hasn't posted to the community for months and wasn't an active participant before that, suggested it.
She asked me if I was trying to say, "Boo hoo, you called me a name and don't like my awesome idea."
And, the mod locked the thread.
So, I messaged her to say that, no, I was not saying that at all. I was just asking why she disagreed. Could she provide any reason at all, because I was honestly interested. The graduation of PCs to NPCs is something that was done in Living City, something that was planned but I don't think ever realized in Living Greyhawk, and could someday be an issue in Fellowship. I wanted honest feedback.
Now, I will admit that my attempt to get discussion blinded me to the possibility that she was simply objecting for the sake of objection. Maybe she didn't have a reason, but just wanted to see how long she could drag out the thread. I even wondered if maybe that was the reason the thread was locked.
After lunch, I saw her reply. Her contentious, rambling, and non-sequitorish reply. And, I also got a message from the moderator saying I was removed. But, not why. I tried to message her back and found that I'd been banned from the community.
I guess I could also point out that the community rules state that there is a three strike process to getting banned? I had no strikes, straight to banned. I assume for sending the private message, which I will agree is in many communities disallowed. It isn't addressed in the Wow_Ladies rules, though. If it had been, I'd have just ignored the person and let it drop. But, since she directly asked me a question which cast me in an uncomfortable light, I replied.
I'm posting the letter I wrote to the moderator here, because I wrote it and don't want it to go to waste. I don't think that anyone on my f-list came here from WoW-Ladies, and if so please know that I'm not trying to besmirch the community or the moderator, or even the person who was baiting me. I'm just getting an annoyance off of my chest.
Kryptongirl,
I guess I didn't realize Wow_Ladies had changed so much in the months while I was away.
To be clear, Reservoir baited and (I now believe) trolled me. She privately messaged me to say that I was "crazy, creepy, disgusting, and cannot read". And, I am the one banned? Upon my first posts returning?
I suppose I could be misreading the subject line. But, I somehow doubt it.
I am hoping you can tell me what I did which was, "aggressive, sexist, or otherwise cause the members ... to feel threatened or uncomfortable." Because, if it was replying to her question, I will understand what kind of community this has become and will gladly remove myself from it.
I will also point out that I began my reply, thusly.
"Now, I understand that the mod closed the thread. And, it may be a breach of etiquette that I message you. I want you to know that I only do so to answer the question you asked."
In other words, as apologetic and non-threatening as possible while still answering the question she directly put toward me.
Should I have just ignored her? I now believe that I should have, as I now believe she was simply trolling me. But, I know that any community has people who go out of their way to harass and annoy other members. I am simply asking if the mods are no longer fair.
Theno
PS, I would have replied to your message to me, but couldn't.
Since the message couldn't be sent, I am assuming that my answer is, "No, the mods are not fair."
Not a great return to LJ. But, hey, one less community on my list.
Maybe I should go through and cut out some others.
Theno