(Untitled)

[theshiversbaby]

Are there any titles for women (along the lines of Miss & Mrs.) that aren't defined by her relationship to a man? I do not consider the frequently-used "Ms." to be a good substitute. "Ms." whines, "I wanted to find a title that didn't automatically declare me either an unwed daughter or a wife, but I lacked the creativity to invent anything

Comments

[studtoughguy]

I eschew "Mr." and sign everything "Col." You could do that.

[theshiversbaby]

I'm also a big fan of "Esq." I don't think women can use it (or at least would look foolish if they did) because it denotes a gentleman. Although now I think it has some other meaning, too. Oh well! Lauren Ogle, Esq. Esquire Lauren Ogle. My title is the name of a popular men's magazine!

[lauraisrad]

There are definitely guys like that out there-- my best friend's boyfriend of 6 years complains all the time that she wants to keep her own last name if they get married. He sometimes attributes her wish to do so to my 'feminist' views affecting her. ugh.

On one hand, I don't like the idea of taking a man's last name b/c its a tradition started by men who felt they OWNED their wives. I obviously dont want to condone and carry on such a demeaning tradition.

On the other hand, my last name isn't particularly important to me, it never has been. My parents divorced when I was 3 and when my mom got remarried, for a long while my dad wouldn't give up his legal rights, so I kept his last name. Then my real dad eventually let my step-dad legally adopt me, so I took a new last name. My name has never really mattered to me, though.

Some people do have a very strong sense of heritage attached to their last name though, and I definitely dont think anyone should give that up just because they decide to marry someone.

[theshiversbaby]

Your situation seems pretty unique, although I'm sure there are other people who aren't overly attached to their surname, either. I've also met a few people whose last names belonged to some guy who basically impregnated their mother and left, and so they were stuck with the name of a man who a) didn't stick around long enough even to see them born and b) they didn't know. I'm fairly attached to mine and, even though it's kind of weird and not very pretty-sounding, it's a part of me

hyphens

[petsounds1966x]

What about both people hyphenating their names? That's always a solution. I hate my last name anyway, I'd just be "Kirk" if it didn't make me seem like a diva-bitch. The only trouble with the hyphenating is sometimes you get awkward-sounding names, but if you can avoid that, I think that's probably the fairest solution. That or, you know, just not changing your name. I don't see the big deal either way, myself.

Re: hyphens

[theshiversbaby]

I have no problem with people keeping their own names, but it gets messy when you bring kids into it. Do you stick them with a long, ugly, hypenated name, or do you choose one? And then, whose do you choose? That's my conundrum right now (er, not personally, since I am unmarried and unpregnant, but it's been bugging me lately).

Re: hyphens

[petsounds1966x]

Well if it's not an ugly hyphenated name, just give them that. If it's really long, I say flip a coin, or just give it to whichever person likes their name A LOT. If you both do, yeah, flipping a coin is fair. Again, if you both have okay-sounding names, I don't see the big deal. But if you have to choose between 'Snargleflag' or 'Berry' or something, I say pick the non-embarassing one.

Re: hyphens

[bluespiralbound]

But then what happens when Bobby Smith-Brown marries Melissa Rosen-Cooper? Then those poor damn kids are going to be the Smith-Rosen-Cooper-Browns! And then, two generations later, everyone commits suicide in kindergarten because their names are too hard and they feel horribly guilty that they can't learn to spell them.

ma-moi-sell-e

[exquisitemayhem]

Mlle.
Why, but of course! The only requirement is that you'll have to become French. But still, it is lovely, is it not?

p.s. Reading "The Vagabond" by Colette currently. You can see my inspiration, clearly.

Master

[needlesinmyneck]

Yeah. "Mlle." is the sexiest of the titles. I've also always liked "Master" for boys.

And whatever. You're well on your way toward to one of those coveted titles. "Dr." "Look at me... I'm a 'Dr.'!" Wooooo. Beats my "Mr." anyday.

Re: Master

[theshiversbaby]

Sadly, "Master" refers to a young boy. As in six or seven. Look it up. ;)

Re: ma-moi-sell-e

[theshiversbaby]

Aren't mademoiselle and madam the same thing (in essence) as Miss and Mrs.? I really wouldn't know, but that's what I'd always thought!

Also, does ma moi sell e mean something in French? I know "ma" is "but," and "moi" is..."me"? "My"? All right, maybe I don't know. ;) But that would be fascinating!

I don't think I could become French. The women seem far too thin and beautiful for me to keep up with.

[melancholiac85]

I guess it can seem demeaning, but i think its just kind of a tradition. I have thought about it before, and I always thought of it as one of the somewhat harmless ones. I'm not a big fan of hyphens, those could get pretty long. I suppose if I had to change it, I would just have everyone keep their name, and just let people adjust. I know that our society is patriarchal, but does that mean we should halt our cultural practices? i dont know. some societies are matriarchal. its part of their cultural heritage. i suppose america (non-native) as the de-culturizer should probably have halted the patriarchal thing in the first place.
I guess it would be a pain to start writing a new name, and it would suck to lose your old one and sever your name from the family roots. hmm.

[theshiversbaby]

I'm not a fan of hypens, either. I think everyone keeping his or her own name is a good idea, but what do you do when or if you have children? That's the problem that I've been considering lately.

And I suppose it is part of our cultural heritage...but it isn't acceptable to me that so many women are giving up their names and their heritage. And it is completely their choice, I know. I don't blame men for this and I hope no one thinks I'm a big man-hater just because I think about gender issues a lot. I suppose we could find some middle ground where both people could keep their names and their roots without sticking their kids with long, hideous names.