notes of a skeptical thelemite

[tim_maroney]

In response to several interesting questions from mendaxveritas, I set down in epistolary and Socratic form some of my thoughts on interpreting Crowley's work in a skeptical but praxis-oriented light. I've copied some of the dialog here for my own future reference. These notes are not an essay, but may someday form the basis of one.

Comments

[ex_stonemir]

Interesting. We're in agreement (or at least in reasonable proximity) on a number of points here, although perhaps for different reasons (or maybe just from different directions)...

I'm curious, and I recognize that this might be prying, in which case feel free to ignore me. That said, given that you hold that the grade system of the OTO is simply a "traditional framework", and based on "a false psychology" (if I'm reading you correctly), what benefits do you feel you derive from membership in the OTO? Is it purely (or largely) the "social bonding" aspects? Or is there something that hasn't been touched on here?

[paradoxosalpha]

I don't want to put words in Tim's fingers here, but I think the "traditional framework" and "false pychology" to which he objected was more A.'.A.'. than O.T.O. The consequences of A.'.A.'. initiation for individual psychology are better-defined, and Crowley never really "worked the grades" of O.T.O., having joined at VII° and then specially promoted to X°.

Speaking for myself (and in partial contradiction of Tim's thesis, though I agree with most of his points), I derive the following benefits from O.T.O. initiation (not a comprehensive list):

• Punctuation of life-experience with periodic ceremonies.
• An opportunity to recieve, integrate, and transmit esoteric materials in a formal setting.
• The challenge of personal discipline defined through ritual obligations.
• Integration in a social system that combines strong egalitarianism within degrees and bodies, along with an elaborate heirarchy among them.

[ecosystem]

The illusion of self is a product of neurological narrative, in which a massively parallel system creates a story about a unitary character that does not exist.This sentence makes me EXTREMELY happy, so now we're one for one. I don't know if I have ever seen this sentiment expressed with adequate vividness, while still managing to avoid passing positive or negative judgment upon the experience of individuated selfness. Right on

"Thelemite by mandate"

[paradoxosalpha]

Where would such a strange chimera come from?

Whose mandate?

Re: "Thelemite by mandate"

[ecosystem]

I had a conversation once with somebody who conceived of "Thelemites" as being a group of chosen people (chosen by whom, I have no idea) who were, from birth, inherently Thelemites and would be revealed as such through ordeals and initiation. These "Thelemites," according to the guy I talked to, are obligated to take Liber Legis in entirety as a book of laws to which they must answer. Obviously, I do not share this interpretation.

A less extreme example of what I would consider a "Thelemite by mandate" idea: I have talked with people who consider the Law of Thelema to be objectively the correct standard of thought and conduct for the present time, the authority of which issues from any number of sources (Ra-Hoor-Khuit, Aiwass, Aleister Crowley, etc.). The idea that it is a FACT that we are all currently living in the Aeon of Horus, for which there are certain standards of ideal behavior and thought, often lends itself to the idea that the Law of Thelema is or should be binding upon all people, regardless of whether they know it or

Re: "Thelemite by mandate"

[paradoxosalpha]

First type: "Chosen" by Hadit, I suppose. What a funny sort of Thelemic Calvinism! (Or Zionism....)

Second type: I could be mistaken for one of these on my off days. After all, I sometimes use the motto Ignorantia Legis Neminem Excusat! But really, such people need to take a closer look at the Class A Comment. If "All questions of the Law are to be decided...each for himself," then it's only a matter of how effectively any individual might use the forbidden text in question to illuminate her own experience, and no one can "say nay" to the work or langour of another on this score.

[synesis]

According to his journal from the time when he received that rapid-fire burst of Class A texts over a few months, he simply heard the voice and it gave him dictation.

"The only analogy is that of a noble thinker and his stupid, dishonest, and immoral secretary. The dictation is taken down correctly, and given to the world. The last person to be enlightened by it is the secretary himself! So, I take it, is the case with all genius."
-- Crowley, Moonchild

[lassiter]

The illusion of self is a product of neurological narrative, in which a massively parallel system creates a story about a unitary character that does not exist.

Oh, great. NOW you've done it. Um, er, move along folks. Nothing to see here. Pay no attention to that set of uncollapsed vectors behind the curtain.

[muelos]

The term "Thelemite" would seem to be one that requires some footnoting. Perhaps "Rabelaisian Thelemite" would be a useful term for Thelemites who prefer the model of Rabelais to that of Crowley. Then again, perhaps we could really muck things up with such terms as "Maroneyan Thelemite" or "Muelosian Thelemite." I've never heard a very satisfactory definition of "Thelemite" anyway. It's not like people who so identify themselves all vote the same way, or feel the same way about war, or drugs, or family, etc. etc.

All concepts of selfhood are illusory, as per Hume. The illusion of self is a product of neurological narrative, in which a massively parallel system creates a story about a unitary character that does not exist.

Is this "massively parallel system" also an illusion?