A Depressing Article

[jaralith]

I just got this article from one of my professional organizations:

http://www.aol.in/news-story/Confident-women-in-interview-lack-socialskills/2008121104589026000003

Comments

[wretchmuffin]

Only the huge stack of papers on my table prevented headdesk related injuries prompted by this article.

[mokitty]

Best. Comment. Ever.

[max_ambiguity]

The third button? That's like halfway down my shirts! I only offer to unbutton the second.

[wretchmuffin]

I don't really get along with other women and so I could see myself having the same prejudice without really thinking about it

This is an interesting insight, and a work related "issue" that I sometimes experience as well. How disturbingly honest of you.

[eigen_zed]

"The personal is the political." There is no personal solution to this problem. There is no way to play this game effectively and win, or at least, not for all of us. Some outliers might be able to play it, but only enough to reinforce the system. It needs to be dismantled.

[This is what you get when my brain is addled by grading exams.]

[eigen_zed]

I have no idea how to do it in the whole. BUT, here is what I can tell you - if we treat this as a problem that each individual should tackle on her own when it comes to going into an interview, that's not going to work either. All that does is to make individual women feel like there's something wrong with THEM, when that's not the problem

[biascut]

Absolutely. This isn't a problem that women have to face as candidates: it's a problem that women and men have to deal with as hirers. Talking about it so that people can think about their reactions to candidates and analyse the extent to which this prejudice colours their own perceptions is a huge step forward.

Of course, the big question is often how many men just skip past this kind of post because it's not relevant to them.

[rachiestar]

Women who present themselves as confident and ambitious in job interviews are viewed as highly competent but also lacking social skills, according to new study.

The study also found that women who present themselves as modest and cooperative, while well liked, are perceived as low on competence.

Wow. Story of my fucking life.

[the_lady_lily]

Hmmm. I wonder how much the field of competence being tested was (being manager of a computer lab), and what expectations of male and female geekery were in play. I'm not 100% sure that the same expectations would operate in all fields of academia, tbh, even the managerial ones.

[eigen_zed]

Wow, that's a really interesting insight. Thank you for sharing!

[the_lady_lily]

*wince*

Mind you, this also says something about the expectations of the way that R1 schools are going to interact with their students, i.e. hardly at all, that's why they have grad students. As you say lower down, it's a question of the culture of engagement in the department; if for R1 schools, the pastoral role isn't considered even a part of the teaching game, and indeed the teaching part is a burden to be shouldered and got out of the way as soon as possible, they're going to view the characters of their interviewees very differently.

I'm having a bit of a hard time articulating this because my opinion is that even at an R1 institution, lecturers who have any face-time with students should take it incredibly serious and be passionate about teaching, so talking from the other side of the table is a bit of a stretch this afternoon.