Poppies and Remembrance

[yrieithydd]

It was Remembrance Sunday today. We marked it at church with silence at the start of the service this morning and then a 'parish service of remembrance' this evening. I finally managed to do what I've been intending to do for years today and wore both a red and a white poppy

Comments

[yrieithydd]

Nobody commented on mine! This morning during the service it wasn't that obvious because I was wearing them on my cotta. Tonight they were more obvious because they were on my gown! Now they're on my white blouse so again the white poppy tends to vanish!

[atreic]

Interesting argument on this in other corners of the internet.

Having read and thought about that, I think the right thing to do may be to wear a red poppy and a white dove (or a peace sign).

However, I am Very Confused about how pacifist I am. So I need to think about that myself so I understand what I want to say first!

[yrieithydd]

That post of woodpijn's is what prompted my post! It's is very similar to a comment I posted there!#

However, I am Very Confused about how pacifist I am.

I was surprised by how nuanced my pacifism turned out to be when I tried to express it.

[sashajwolf]

A white poppy does seem like an appropriate way of honouring your grandfather.

I find it very hard to understand the visceral dislike of the white poppy.My (great-)aunt had this (just before I read this post, I'd actually used the word "visceral" elsewhere to describe her reaction against the white poppy.) My great-uncle was in the Merchant Navy and permanently ruined his health on the Arctic Convoys by giving away bits of his uniform (against direct orders) to women and children who were freezing to death in St. Petersburg, where my uncle's ship was iced in. He was never the same again afterwards, but it took him till 1968 to die. My aunt took the white poppy as a statement that the war should not have been fought, that my uncle should never have been sent on the convoys. How could she have got through those 23 years, and then another 26 of widowhood, believing that? The cognitive dissonance would have killed her. She had to believe that the PPU was wrong, and she had to believe it vehemently, just to keep getting up in the morning

[keith_underdown]

Actually your grandfather wasn't a conscientious objector but he took a principled decision to be a non-combatant. He was a medical orderly (read nurse) in the RAF and the RAF regiment. He was left mentally scarred by the experience; first of all trying to help injured men back to health and then, and much worse, trying to help civilians liberated from Japanese concentration camps.

I believe that he would have been much happier and more able to come to terms with his experiences if had ben able to be a nurse in civvy street but male nurses were only to be found in mental hospitals back then.

Your maternal grandfather was also a non-combatant. He chose to be a naval chaplain not an army or air force chaplain as naval chaplains were not expected to bear arms, unlike army chaplains.

[yrieithydd]

Ok. So what's the difference between conscientious objection and a principled decision to be a non-combatant?

[keith_underdown]

A conscientious objector will not serve in the armed forces even if called up and risks going to prison or having to g on the run. To be a non-combatant means serving in the armed forces but in role that does not involve fighting. As a medical orderly my father did receive the same basic training as everybody else and did have a service issue revolver but ti was never used.

I would guess that going in as a non-combatant would almost be harder than being a CO. The latter is likely to have a good support network but a non-combatant is likely to get all sorts of stick from fellow recruits until he or she starts performing their full duties. Being first on the scene of a crash at an airfield demands a certain kind of courage.