the king and his debtors

[aethyrflux]

According to this article on the Prisoner's Dilemma, "A New Way To Think About Rules To Live By," by Carl Sagan

Comments

[gnosticelf]

I swear, once upon a time I had a mind that ruminated as much as yours does...can't say what happened to it, though. I still do, I suppose, but damned if I can put it into words like this anymore.

*sigh*

[aethyrflux]

whoa, if i'm not careful, all of my rambling may turn into something vaguely cohesive, like Howard Bloom's Grand Unified Theory of Everything In the Universe Including the Human Soul

[slackananda]

I haven't written a book because I never had a clear and lasting impression of a book I could write that needed to exist. I've recently been considering a non-fiction topic for a full-length work. I think the best way to approach that is to make the writing of the book a secondary, documentary part of another process, fully significant in its own right. Thus, the work becomes a product (byproduct?) of process instead of a goal in itself. The book is discovered, not created from whole cloth. The best part is, a destination is not required for a beginning.

[sheilagh]

I love posts like these, even though I haven't got the time to follow them down so many rabbit holes.

One suggesting, if you'd entertain it?

I'm on a mailing list that has similarly dense entries, albeit not as frequently. They post "attention conservation notices" at the front of each long missive. The notice also includes a sentence or two explaining the range of topics covered so that people can chose to conserve their attention or dive in deep.

Just a thought...

[aethyrflux]

but how can i be mysterious and mystical, if i prompt people with intros? ;~}

seriously though, your constructive criticism has been duly noted...
maybe lj needs a new meta-tag header?

and i am certain that your progressive perspective would benefit the feng shui at the mojo meetings, if you're ever free on a wednesday night!

Lobo's Golden Rule

[slackananda]

I praise your dense, hyperlink-ridden entries. I am no longer afraid of my own intellectual sprawl. Seriously though, I'm impressed. I can't say I tried to follow every branch, but I did appreciate your link to Doktor Dynasoar's rant:"We are not the kind of beings that fit in; that's why we are what we are. Expecting us to fit in even amongst ourselves is a reasonable but fatal mistake."
I'd love to post this image right here in my comment, but I'll save the bandwidth for the thoughtful remarks still to come.

Re: Lobo's Golden Rule

[aethyrflux]

concerning group dynamics, i have been wondering how little structure is too little...
a la "The Tyranny of Structurelessness," by Jo Freeman, which i attempted to analyze in my post, "Work, & be our bed in working!"

thanks for your sense of humor, i forget about that stuff sometimes...

Re: Lobo's Golden Rule

[slackananda]

What sense of humor?

Re: Lobo's Golden Rule

[slackananda]

Having popped off with the first (possibly) semi-witty remark to cross my mind, I took a look at the first link.... then bookmarked it. I'm starting a bookmark folder called "Aethyrflux Overflow." Thanks in advance for the time I won't spend staring at Google thinking to myself, "You've got to be able to come up with something to look for!"

[vharshyde]

Theres a reason I try my best to avoid that mythos.

[vharshyde]

Though, logic is borne by the statements of the "wicked servant", who knew that if he begged the lord forgiveness, he'd get away with it. He knew that trick, and someone tried to use it on him. So he knew that this servant was merely attempting to get out of paying him...

I am not a believer of the conceptual bringings of "Blessed is the mind too small for doubt", nor am I in that of "The tree of knowledge is laden with sin"

[aethyrflux]

He knew that trick

the prover proves what the thinker thinks.

Blessed is the mind too small for doubt

We place no reliance
On virgin or pigeon
Our method is science
Our aim is Religion.

- from "The Equinox"

The tree of knowledge is laden with sin

"The Word of Sin is Restriction"
(Liber AL vel Legis, sub figura CCXX, I.41)

[aethyrflux]

careful that you don't lump too much in the same category...

Off and running

[hanzatsu]

For some reason this discussion reminded me of a criminology theory that I was introduced to briefly in one of my criminology classes. I couldn't remember what the theory was called but after many different yahoo searches- I came upon an article mentioning it. It's basically biological arguments that antisocial and criminal behavior is caused by a slow response time or low level of response caused by the autonomic nervous system.

Here's a clip explaining- first two paragraphs of theories of fearlessness and stimulation seeking Biosocial Studies...Now- what does this have to do with tit for tat

Re: Off and running

[aethyrflux]

I concur with your logic, as this sort of situation has been demonstrated to me in my own life, and my brother continues to be a perfect example of this sort of refusal to work with the system...
Bad attention is better than no attention at all, right (or better than a perceived state of no attention while waiting for the stimulation to be recognized by the slow autonomic nervous system)?

I have always thought that a lot of the issue related to laziness, essentially...
These sociopathic types could certainly get attention from developing positive non-zero sum relationships; but instead, they seem to want the quick-fix of retribution/punishment from other individuals/society. However, as your example article says, the situation is not so simple, and it is likely that a combination of these factors will better explain the situation, rather than any of the particular influences taken alone