I meta, therefore I am.

[bandgeek]

So I've been reading about feminist criticism of Hamlet for my Lit Studies class. But what I'm interested in isn't so much the Hamlet stuff itself (although I'm sure we can all ruminate on Ophelia until the cows come home). What I'd really like to know more about is this

Comments

[thisficklemob]

So here's my question to you: is there, in your perception, a gender to writing? ... If I presented you with two unlabelled samples of prose, would you be able to tell which was written by a man, and which by a woman?I suppose it partially depends on the subject of the paragraph. In many cases, I'd say no. On the other hand, if the subject were one that typically evoked different responses in women and men, then that might come through in the paragraph

[bandgeek]

Hmm ... yeah, I can definitely see how gender would matter when it comes to men's vs. women's socio-political experiences. I guess something I'm interested in that vein is whether or not a man can really understand or write from the perspective of a female. Regardless of his level of sympathy toward women, I mean. I guess I'm not really thinking as much of politics as of just the way men and women experience the world ... kind of like as much as I can read and try to sympathize with men, I will never really know what it's like to get a blowjob. :)

[thisficklemob]

Hee hee. Yeah, I don't know the answer to that. And I think it's all filtered through our own sense of gender ownership as well... it's much easier to say, "women don't think like that, he doesn't understand women," about a male author. If a female author writes what seems to us an unauthentic female voice, we're left more with questions like, "Who the hell is she? Is that really how she thinks?" or else we question her insight and skill as a writer, period

[bandgeek]

Eeek! Revelation! :)

It's the power dynamic! This is making all kinds of sense to me. In order for women to survive, we've had to get good at understanding and appeasing men. Oh, wow ... I guess I've always thought of women's empathy as something more biological, but this is so much more logical.

Must ... set up ... scientific ... study ...

[dualbunny]

I would tend to say no, but it seems entirely dependent on the subject. I would say that some male and female authors definitely relate better to male or female characters, and at times that comes through. Other times it seems pretty indistinguishable.

Unless the actions or storyline are obviously sexist, I can't say that it's something I think about when reading (which I've done woefully little of lately). On the other hand, I do feel very off kilter if the gender of a character or viewpoint isn't designated clearly. In order for me to relate or not relate to a story, I seem to feel the need to have my own gender biases firmly in place.

I think gender can be manipulated through writing though. Or rather writing can be used to work in a certain manner on genders. Not across the board, but to a majority at least. I have no idea how many authors take that into consideration when they write, however. And if it has benefits or not.

(Interesting post! :])

[bandgeek]

Hmm ... you're probably the first person I've talked to who says that they don't see any real difference. Eeenteresting. :)

[beamer242]

what about women's writing of male slash? Do we as writers put a feminine slant on a masculine subject?Oh, most definitely. Women have a tendency to over romanticize the relationship between two men. In slash written by women, the two characters have a tendency to spend an over abundance of time kissing and fondling each other. We write two male characters having sex the way we want to have sex. I'm not saying that men don't like to hug and kiss and fondle each other, it's just that they have a tendency to just jump in there. They don't pay much attention the the foreplay

[bandgeek]

I've kind of noticed this too, that we characterize these relationships as being far more touchy-feely than they really are ... I don't have extensive contact with gay male couples, but from what I've picked up, you're right, there seems to be much more of a just-get-down-to-it attitude. And while I feel a little bit guilty for fictionalizing something like this, I wouldn't be as interested in reading about a relationship so, well, unartistic.

As for the talky sex, I think I'm in a bit of a minority in saying that most of the time, I don't like it. Unless it's really well-written and believable, it tends to feel to me more like an effort to flesh out an otherwise sparsely worded scene. And I really, honestly can't see myself ever yelling, "oh god, SpikeTaraLogan, my loins are dripping with the sweet juices of arousal!" *g*

I wonder, then, if Annie Proulx had any special research or experience or insight in her characterizations of Ennis and Jack in Brokeback Mountain ... they kiss a little bit, but they embrace maybe twice,

[beamer242]

I would much rather read porn that patterned itself after it's moving picture counterpart than a real true life relationship. That would be a yawner. Even in film, men aren't talkers.

I'm with you. I dislike talky sex 95% of the time. It has to be extremely well written for me to find it believeable. I suspect that most of the time it's not written because it's thought to be sexy, but because many people find it difficult to read paragraphs that have very little conversation. I mean, after all, who in their right mind would find 'oh god, yes, AngelClarkWesley, pummel me with that big jack hammer of love of yours' sexy?

[bandgeek]

I suspect that most of the time it's not written because it's thought to be sexy, but because many people find it difficult to read paragraphs that have very little conversation.

Totally. So I suppose really, this calls for a little innovation. Finding a way to write sex without descriptive dialogue. Sounds like a good challenge ... :)

[snarkhunter]

yay! L'ecriture feminine!

I don't have time to leave a really well thought-out response right now, but I will later, b/c French feminism interests me on both a personal and a professional level. I will say, though, that while there is some merit to the notion of gendered communication, I think it does the world a disservice to seek to utterly sever women's writing from men's.

Anyway. I will respond in detail later--possibly with quotes! (You've woken the English PhD student, you see.)

By the way, you were in my dream last night. I was lecturing a class on the concept of negative space (which is weird, since I dont' know much about it), and used "The Body" as an example...and you were there.

[bandgeek]

Yay! I had a feeling I might spark your interest with this one. :)

Hmm ... I was in your class, eh? Was I making lewd gestures and commenting loudly on all things fandom?

[bandgeek]

Hmm ... see, I'm usually much more bull-headed about it, and just assume that I'm the tortured genius, and everyone else has got it wrong. ;)