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[borogove13]

I was already depressed, so this coming up is probably hitting me worse than it should.  A few times this week, I've been described and recommended as a kind of surrogate boyfriend: a guy to call on when an actual romantic interest isn't available or interested in an activity.  I think that in each case, the intention was to say that I'm nice,

Comments

[raidingparty]

At the opposite end, I've heard women complaining about boys considering them "fuckable but not good enough to date".

[borogove13]

That's not the opposite end. What the hell? Do you think I'm an idiot who doesn't recognize that there's misogyny and general dismissiveness of women rampant amongst men? Pisses me off when I see it, especially in industries I'm a part of where women with impressive skills get forced out by boy's clubs of less skilled men who can't get over their dicks and realize the value of the abilities of another person. It's a disease in improv, and I've seen it fuck over great animators. My shit doesn't even compare. I don't expect any of these women to be attracted to me just because I share an interest. That's a reason for friendship, not necessarily romance. My problem is when they don't let it be just that, because when it's brought up as something they wish their boyfriend or husband did, that queers the idea of just having fun with a friend and places me in an unwanted surrogate position. Hell, when it comes up, I'm probably more disappointed in the boyfriends or husbands for not giving an honest try at something their wife or

[raidingparty]

Ah... I apologize. It wasn't meant to be a commentary relating directly to you, just sort of similar to the "you're not good enough to be happy, but you're useful enough to be used". And no, I don't think you're an idiot.

In other news, I'm also familiar with the friend zone. It's fantastically amazing, no? :P

I used to get the palpable mood after dances as well, although from a different source: It's ending and I didn't get what I was hoping for out of the experience.
I tend to be much more upbeat about dancing with women who aren't romantically available:
- It's fun for its own sake
- Best case scenario, they become advocates and spies on my behalf
- I look good doing it, and perhaps someone on the sidelines notices
Of course, the last part still has yet to specifically work out that way, and tango often feels like a closed system where everyone's partnered, so... blah.

[borogove13]

That "friend zone" shit is also not applicable. I am friends with women who I want to be friends with. If I only want to have a romantic relationship with them and they aren't interested, I don't pretend to be their friend in the hopes that they'll change their mind, I move on. That passive-aggressive "I think I'm a nice guy, but really I'm an opportunist" crap bothers the hell out of me. Sure I have women friends who I consider to be attractive, but I don't assume that they have any reason to also find me attractive (especially if they're currently in a relationship or married), and I certainly don't go moaning about a "friend zone" if our friendship stays just that, because I'm not friends with them just because they're attractive. Hell, I often don't consider somebody physically attractive until I've already connected in some other way. I like being friends with women for the same reason I like being friends with men: I enjoy their company, they're interesting, usually challenge me in some way, we have shared interests are