Comments | irlandesak: Ugly Betty: It ain't so superior

irlandesak

Ugly Betty: It ain't so superior

Apr 11, 2010 03:22

Oops, this is in response to someone else's post. It was too long to leave as a comment so I'm posting it here. I'm so not used to actually posting my own journals that I forget others can read it and would appreciate not having a 14000 character post so I'll put it under the cut and you can move along if you wish.

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yo soy betty la fea, ugly betty

Comments 13

Sorry, I rambled a lot in this comment... firthgal April 11 2010, 13:00:58 UTC

HERE HERE! Just want to note that I agree with every single word in this post. There is so much wrong with the writing of Ugly Betty, and most of my issues are not D/B related. In fact, D/B is the only thing that's kept me holding onto this hot mess of a show (of course, I do rant quite often in a ship-related sense, but more often than not my issues are with the writing of the opposing ships and not the ships themselves, especially Betty/Henry, which I actually loved in theory but hated in practice).

It was one of those romances that just wasn't pretty but I thought it made for compelling television.

YES! OMG, so much yes. I was trying to figure out exactly why Betty and Armando own my soul so completely despite their unhealthiness, because at a few points he is trying to force himself on her and I am somehow equally mortified and turned on and disgusted with myself, but I think those were the exact feelings that Betty was struggling with in those moments, so it worked. And I knew that Armando's goal was not to force her ( ... )

Re: Sorry, I rambled a lot in this comment... firthgal April 11 2010, 13:17:06 UTC

Oh! By the way, just wanted to tell you that I've officially fallen in love with the Russian version. The differences between Andrey/Katya and Armando/Betty are starting to really stand out. I love that Andrey is more delighted by Katya than annoyed by her, which you can really see during the whole trip to the banks with Katya's father. Armando was completely eye-rolly and sighy and pretty much just saw Betty and her father and the broken down car as a burden and just another part of his crappy day, but Andrey was completely amused and quite sweet and by the end of it he has his arm around Katya and they already look so much like a married couple that I just melted. Of course, I will not lie, I'm pretty sure that Armando was delighted by the whole experience too, he just wouldn't admit it (because his personality didn't really allow for it. Everything was an annoyance to him. Andrey is slightly more laid back ( ... )

Re: Sorry, I rambled a lot in this comment... irlandesak April 11 2010, 17:37:26 UTC

I really just don't know how you follow along but now I want someone to subtitle this sucker because I know it's good.

Everything was an annoyance to him. Andrey is slightly more laid back

Armando was awful. And it's why I'm always surprised by myself at the end.

Thanks for the clips, I absolutely will watch them.

There is so much wrong with the writing of Ugly Betty, and most of my issues are not D/B related.

Exactly. They're no more D/B related than they are with any other character.

Er... anyway, the Colombian version succeeds in so many areas where the American version fails, namely in the area of making the audience relate to Betty through her entire journey.Exactly. I have a friend who somewhat shipped D/B in the beginning but basically grew to hate Betty so now that it's happening, she can't really experience the high. And I get that because Betty did annoy me a lot as the series wore on. It annoyed me that almost every single one of her relationships involved a triangle. It annoyed me that she landed the number ( ... )

quaggy_mire April 11 2010, 14:37:19 UTC

Hello you! It's been forever! I'm so glad you posted this here, because I wouldn't have had a chance to read it otherwise.

I'm so behind on Ugly Betty, it's just sad, but I agree with everything that you've said here. I even watched some of the original Betty La Fea, when it aired in the States, but my Spanish is only halfway decent, so I missed a lot. I like how you pointed out that the original Betty "did ugly things". That's a nice twist on the title (and true since a lot of the stuff she did wasn't really heroic.)

I do ship Daniel/Betty, since best friend ships are my weakness and the show certainly gives us a lot of nice moments. Betty and Daniel don't ever particularly give me the "brother/sister" vibe, probably because Daniel regularly gets that "Betty" look. Sometimes he looks at her like he's just so impressed with her and just being with her makes him so happy, he doesn't know what to do with himself. It's probably the purest love Daniel's ever experienced. If I wrote fic, (Oh, wait! I do!) I would ID the moment at the ( ... )

irlandesak April 11 2010, 17:20:58 UTC

I'm so thrilled to see you. It has been a while and I've been thinking a lot about J/D lately so it's great to see someone I met through that fandom. (And OMG, I just went to your LJ and you're a Life fan too? Wow.)

Where I think the show goes wrong a lot is that they try to manufacture drama instead of going with their strengths, which would be the character interaction. They keep manufacturing internal conflicts (Daniel and Betty have a failing out, Amanda and Mark don't speak, Betty moves out of the house) instead of going with an outside force that causes everyone to react.

Absolutely. Another drawback is that they have the characters make progress only to regress them again. I have no clue why they thought it was a good idea for the characters of Amanda or Daniel to put them back into their "friends with benefits" storyline while she was his assistant.

Or like when they moved Betty out of house and in with Amanda (inspired) but then put her back in Queens.

You know, I wonder if Matt was created deliberately as a ( ... )

quaggy_mire April 13 2010, 02:35:03 UTC

What was the show that tried to create a similar character? Showrunners can be so...dumb sometimes. Oh, you would never have heard of it. It was a Canadian family sitcom called Life With Derek. The show was only okay, but the fandom is incredible and totally sucked me in. It was a Brady Bunch/Step-by-Step sort of premise about a blended family, but most people loved the dynamic between the two oldest step-siblings Casey & Derek. Of course, the show didn't want to hook up the characters, because of the step-sibling thing, so their solution was to create another "bad boy" character in the last season for Casey. This failed for a number of reasons, but mainly because (1) the new boyfriend was a total jerk, with none of Derek's redeeming characteristics and (2) people didn't want Derek with Casey because he was a bad boy. They wanted him with Casey because they seemed like they would be a good couple. (Plus the two actors had a lot of chemistry ( ... )

arabian April 11 2010, 17:03:23 UTC

I never watched any of UB version, but I completely agree (almost) on everything you wrote here. My almost is that I actually LOVED Henry -- he is what made me a Christopher Gorham fan and I've now watched everything CG's done, and I loved Betty/Henry originally. But I loved them as a precursor to Daniel/Betty. And, of course, I agree that Horta screwed up them and Henry. I'm also in the minority in that I liked Gio, not with Betty per se, but I liked the character. Other than that, yeah, I totally agree.

irlandesak April 11 2010, 17:25:03 UTC

I thought Gio was interesting, I just didn't like his dynamic with Betty.

I was conflicted about Henry. I did like him for a while before I grew to resent that he had been made a regular because it seemed so obvious that Horta was struggling with what he wanted to do with Henry now that he had him. And since he was struggling in other places, I wanted to get bcak to the core group.

A post directed to me? Wow! ^_^ (pt.1) cloakedhestia April 12 2010, 02:32:59 UTC

First off, it's always great to know I can provoke long, impassioned responses and I totally read everything! (Don't apologize for getting carried away in long posts. Everyone should do it if they have something important to say.) This is a very good and interesting response, and I agree with you on several points which is great! It makes me feel like opposing shippers aren't so different...

But I guess I should give my rebuttal, so to speak. And I'll try to keep it short where possible. (...Right.)

The fact that you base your enjoyment of your ship on the original is understandable, I think. Though I'm kind of horrified by the original because I just came from portiaslegacy's journal where she wrote a scathing critique on the Colombian original of Betty La Fea and romance in general. It may be biased but piecing together some of the comments on how "Armando" behaved and how manipulative and dark their romance is, well... I can appreciate good angst and drama where necessary as long as it's balanced by some fun and fluff. Actually ( ... )

Re: A post directed to me? Wow! ^_^ (pt.2) cloakedhestia April 12 2010, 02:34:55 UTC

In conclusion, I'll concede that the American and Spanish versions are equally good and flawed in their ways. I'll also concede that H/B shippers heap as much scorn on Gio as the D/B shippers heap on Henry. (Though because of the larger numbers of D/B shippers online it seems that probability-wise, there is literally more dislike of Henry then of Gio. Or Matt. Or that guitar guy. Oh, and of Daniel.) I concede on several things and on the rest it would probably fall under "agree to disagree ( ... )

Re: A post directed to me? Wow! ^_^ (pt.2) irlandesak April 13 2010, 16:49:34 UTC

(BTW, this is Part 2--I may have posted Part 1 in the wrong spot by accident so look below first.)

However, may I ask, (and this can be for any D/B shipper who would like to answer) does Daniel's feelings of love seem just a little bit rushed? Especially given the brother/sister crap you've been getting from Silvio and how Daniel and Betty could've easily had more flirty moments than they should've.

he was sleeping with Amanda not too long ago and he was dating some airhead model in that very same episode, so if I was a shipper, I'd be a bit annoyed at Daniel over that.If you're asking if I would have wanted a couple more episodes with scenes like Betty inviting Daniel to the wedding and Daniel teasing her about whether or not it's a date? Absolutely. You're talking to a shipper. Many shippers I know ranted at the absolute lack of D/B screen time in some of the of the previous episodes...probably starting around the Bahamas eppie. It's why were pleasantly shocked by what transpired in the last episode. A lot of people were ( ... )

irlandesak April 13 2010, 16:48:53 UTC

Let's see if I can do the reply in one shot, shall we? (Nope) Will split in two.

The fact that you base your enjoyment of your ship on the original is understandable, I think.

Not just the ship. The show. The fact that the original, for all its faults, knew what it was and where it was going. I'm sure by now you've seen our back and forths in the eppie thread about it.

I guess I let it slide because for all the Betty mis-characterization and nonsensical twists, the show was initially different from what much of American TV had to offer. Initially it was very refreshing. I loved the first season even if I still had "comparitis" and had a hard time reconciling that this show came from that source material. But then Horta fired much of his first season writing staff (Fail!) and the show waded into incessant triangles, a Betty love life where I had a tough time believing the plethora of men falling at her feet and not enough time developing her as a career professional. I could list many things that frustrated me but the biggest ( ... )