Comments | lucinda428: Discussion the last: Episode 314

lucinda428

Discussion the last: Episode 314

Jun 05, 2006 14:11

Thanks to everyone who has contributed to these discussions over the 56 episodes in question.

Tonight's episode was directed by Kelly Makin (as we heard 500 times on the DVD extras) and written by Ron and Dan themselves. Not, as we will see, their best effort, but they did at least give B/J a fitting ending.

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Comments 23

justinlovesart June 5 2006, 08:38:26 UTC

Thank you for these discussions! And for putting up with my Justinism ( ... )

lucinda428 June 5 2006, 13:07:03 UTC

Kelly Makin is a burly bloke. (Guess he and Gale Harold have a lot to talk about: both "a boy named Sue".) He's on the S3 DVD "extras" feature where they talk about 314. He talks at length about alotting all the characters different colours in the rainbow flag for this episode.

3. Leave my Justin alone! It's the last episode, let him be the blond plot device CL always wanted him to be!

Well, here's the thing. He's a lot more interesting when he's not a blond plot device.

4. Justin wants a sidekick and wants Brian to be the one.

Not strictly true. Justin has given up the superhero biz - now he's only drawing them. I guess my real question is, why isn't he suggesting they do something as a team? Why does Brian have to save everyone all the time?

5. The asshole being Brian himself, since he is the one who wrote the Stockwell advert.LOL! Completely true. I'm sure, however, that by "some asshole" he does mean Justin. I love how he's looking for Justin's approval in that scene - he's given up everything for a piece of blond ( ... )

justinlovesart June 5 2006, 21:09:07 UTC

6. Brian admires Stockwell, but he is also horrified that Stockwell is so "similar" to him. I think that the scary thing is that Cowlip admired Stockwell and that their secret fantasy was having Stockwell and Brian fuck, win the election and move to New York together.

What are you on, and can the rest of us have some? I will allow some similarities between Brian and Stockwell, but after that -- well, I think you owe Anita money.
I was joking, yet not completely. I believe that part of the Stockwell plot was meant to show Brian facing someone very similar to himself in terms of drive, determination, ambition and focus on individual achievement that can border on ruthlessness. Of course, we know that Brian is not really like that, but he has certainly built a public persona based on those "principles ( ... )

teary_eyed2 June 6 2006, 11:39:03 UTC

You can think them, but if others want to discuss this point, please foreshadow and I will do a related flocked post. I don't like discussing real people on public LJ.

*rushes to flock 90% of my posts you've commented on immediately* :b

I can't believe you've come to the end as you know it: 314. It's been an enjoyable and rather leisurely ride (thank god, since daily road trips wear me out), even if Justin does get put in the boot, um, trunk a lot of the time (or is that the boot gets put into him a lot of the time?). It would have been nice to see him work the Gale gear stick more often (unfortunately, S4 doesn't count in your universe) :)

Thread 6

paddies June 5 2006, 10:09:59 UTC

Has Kelly Makin thought this through, and if so what's he trying to say?

I just think they couldn't do the whole episode in B/W, so they made their point in the first scene and then just "went back to normal". :-)

Is the famous scene between Brian and Emmett at Babylon redundant?

Not really, because even tho Emmett never "suffered" from a hero worship complex like the rest of Brian's friends, he does admire/respect Brian deeply and he needed someone to tell him the truth without endorsing it...that's kind of Brian's job. ;-)

Surely he could cut Brian a break?

Justin never does that, that's one of the reasons Brian loves him ;-)

Does Justin realise the ad is Brian's work? If not, why not? If so, why doesn't he realise Brian must know who the Concerned Citizens for the Truth are? In their hand-washing conversation he allows Brian to sound as confuzzled as he is, but hey, they're the client!Uhm... I'm pretty sure that justin knows that the spot is Brian's work...I don't think he knows that Brian had to actually pay for it all by ( ... )

lucinda428 June 5 2006, 13:12:18 UTC

Thanks for speaking up this week, cara lurker. It's always lovely to have you.

Not really, because even tho Emmett never "suffered" from a hero worship complex like the rest of Brian's friends, he does admire/respect Brian deeply and he needed someone to tell him the truth without endorsing it...that's kind of Brian's job. ;-)

Poor Brian. For an unemployed person, he's got a lot of jobs.

Surely he could cut Brian a break?
Justin never does that, that's one of the reasons Brian loves him ;-)

That's true. I wondered whether he was being deliberately unsympathetic to lessen Brian's anxiety. I don't think he really knows how bad it is, yet.

It's just "pure Brian". He helps his friend and he's totally snarky and apparently "heartless" at the same time.

Isn't it also another reminder that Brian's friends have a very skewed picture of him?

Because they don't need it. It's so obvious that it would actually be redundant. ;-)

I like your explanation best already :D

ef26 June 5 2006, 11:48:16 UTC

3. he criticizes him because it's largely brian's fault that stockwell has gained so much popularity. he doesn't want to "hurt" him tough, he says everything as an half joke. He's trying to push him to do something ( ... )

lucinda428 June 5 2006, 13:17:17 UTC

That's an interesting take on #3.

7. it's a mistake IMO, justin should know or at least guess that brian has something to do with the ads, but instead in the "possession withdrawal" scene he sounds quite surprised by the news brian gives him.

As paddies points out, Justin could believe that Brian had made the ads, but that wouldn't necessarily mean he'd paid for them. Justin seems to be assuming there is a client who is not Brian. My problem is just, why doesn't he think Brian will have met this client? Most irregular.

brian wanted to eat

This is not an argument that will stand up in a court of law! LOL. I know Brian does eat, really. Occasionally. I just find it really hard to believe he would eat a lemon bar.

Re #14, yes, it's quite clear what you're saying, if complicated. I broadly agree.

thanks for all these discussions, I really enjoyed them :)

You're very welcome. So did I. Thanks for your contributions.

stellasurya June 5 2006, 19:23:11 UTC

1. At least they are matching in colour - which means they are Together. We'll always have 514!
In some analyses, blue is the colour of the emotions - Kelly Makin may not have known this of course, but unconsciously ... ?

2. It's not redundant because Brian has the integrity of character (that both the capricious Lindsay and shilly-shallying Emmett don't have) to make the point forceful enough, so that Em would listen at last. It's as more about who says something strong like this rather than the words themselves IMO. It's tough love, but it's still love - and Brian is absolutely full of the Big L is this ep ( ... )

stellasurya June 6 2006, 07:03:29 UTC

Shit! I meant 314, obviously. I can't believe I typed that ... ! *ick*

lucinda428 June 6 2006, 08:08:09 UTC

Neither can I! But we all understood you. You really can't do maths, can you?

lucinda428 June 6 2006, 08:04:44 UTC

2. It's not redundant because Brian has the integrity of character (that both the capricious Lindsay and shilly-shallying Emmett don't have) to make the point forceful enough

and Brian is absolutely full of the Big L is this ep

These are both excellent points. Lindsay and Emmett between them take "capricious" to a new level. And yes, Brian is learning that once you let love in, it just expands till you can't help being kind to every deadbeat and his brother. Even Michael!

3. I thought Justin was pretty playful in this scene, there's not much sting in his words therefore.

This was a scene where I found Randy unaccountably flat. A nasty foreshadowing of where he was going in S4. To my ear it maybe makes Justin snarkier than he was written to be.

But the hair has reached sheer perfection at this point. It appears that the truth is that this is a boy who suits a basin-cut. Although the back is long, the main layering runs all the way round his head at eyebrow-level. Randy for Prince Valiant!

4. I think it's just a wish ( ... )

stellasurya June 5 2006, 19:36:05 UTC

10. *Happy sigh* What I always see is, Brian really loves Justin, whereas Ethan didn't. And Justin knows it. The rest of my higher critical faculty turns to mush when I watch this scene. *melts*

11. Cow. Bloody. Lip. That's why!
But Brian always did try to fit Michael into his life as well, seeing as the latter is SO pathetic.

12. Are we supposed to conclude, from this episode, that Lindsay and Melanie are self-centred to the point of requiring psychiatry?
Yes.
Also, CowLip couldn't write the Lesbians for toffee.

13. See answer to #11 above. Brian is a hero, so Michael has to be one too I suppose. Pathetic.

14. ITA with paddies. They didn't need to say the words, they knew.

lucinda428 June 6 2006, 08:14:06 UTC

But Brian always did try to fit Michael into his life as well, seeing as the latter is SO pathetic.

Yeah, as this relationship continues I'm reminded of nothing more than the smart, sporty school captain who is delegated by the headmaster to "look after" the new kid who is too hopeless to feed himself otherwise, and who totally cramps the captain's style from that day forth. I know we're supposed to believe Michael was actually Brian's saviour, but I can't actually watch Hal and hold that idea in my head at the same time.

14. ITA with paddies. They didn't need to say the words, they knew.

Which is exactly why this is where we leave them. Before the amnesia and the MPD claim them.