Excellent!senseofpeaceOctober 29 2007, 23:37:37 UTC
Whew, kind friend, you have no idea how much I appreciate this update. I have been thoroughly impressed with the work that you've been doing in this story, and this update is a good example of the high quality. The conversation between Jack and Ellie was so needed. I am glad that Jack has someone with whom he can be honest. This was a lovely update. Thank you for sharing. I so look forward to what happens next.
Re: Excellent!vln_bbmfanOctober 30 2007, 03:41:27 UTC
Thank you so much. I've been struggling for weeks with this chapter, and mostly with this conversation. I took it out several times, but it kept worming it's way back in. I finally gave up the fight and here it is. I hope the rest of this chapter doesn't disappoint. :-)
Thanks for the comment. I originally thought this part would take up two postings, but it turned out to do better as one. Hopefully I can get the next part into one posting, and that will complete the chapter. I apologize for the long delay, but this really has been a difficult chapter to write.
Fan - damn - tastic!cynical21October 30 2007, 00:22:42 UTC
I think it's long past time that a gifted author - and you sure fill that bill beautifully - explored this possibility; the idea that one or the other partner might prefer to TOP or to BOTTOM but that such a desire has absolutely nothing to do with being manly or girly. Don't all of us have sexual preferences - what we like and dislike, what we want and don't want. Why should gay men - or gays in general - be any different, and why shoould such preferences lock the person in question into a role he's not comfortable in playing. For that matter, there are plenty of men who like to be dominated, and plenty of women who like to wield that power - none of which qualifies as 'unnatural'. This is a splendid plotline, Vicki, and a wonderful perception of what Jack and Ennis could be together.
Re: Fan - damn - tastic!cynical21October 30 2007, 02:59:05 UTC
Nice observations, Ted - and you do have the advantage of being more intimately familiar with male physiology. Plus, I too can sympathize with Jack wishing for Ennis to experience the sensations that he experiences in being 'fuckee rather than fucker'. But I do know a number of gay couples - several who are very good friends - who seem to fit this profile. Now granted, we don't do much sitting around discussing the intimate details of their relationships, but neither is the subject verboten, and they do drop hints occasionally, and none of us get embarrassed about it. People do have preferences. For example - just a minor point - I have a friend, a lovely, voluptuous woman whom I've known for 20 years, who has been involved with a handsome, virile man for the last decade. They are a passionate couple, neither unwilling to explore their sexuality, and yet, as confessed to me on many occasions, she does not like having him fondle, kiss, or otherwise manipulate her breasts. I have to tell you that when she told me that for the first time
( ... )
Re: Fan - damn - tastic!vln_bbmfanOctober 30 2007, 04:09:26 UTC
For whatever reason, it just turns her off.
Thanks for sharing that, CYN. Sometimes that's the way it is, with no real rhyme or reason. It's what makes us all individuals. I think that when it comes to sex, most of us have something that just doesn't do it for us. Doesn't make that particular act wrong for anyone but us, and having a partner that accepts this is just as important as accepting it for ourselves, IMHO.
All Shook Up 10acwby30October 30 2007, 00:28:19 UTC
Afternoon, Vicki.
Well, that was unexpected and just what the doctor ordered. Ellie talking to Jack, spelling it out, saying what Jack knew had to be said, and what Ennis was afraid to say. Now, Jack and Ennis have to have 'the talk' themselves.
Interesting, Jack and Ennis both want what they had on Brokeback, and both thought they needed to do something different to get it back. When in fact, all they had to do was be themselves, do what they love the best to the person they love. Guess we should all think about that, thinking we have to change ourselves to be loved, when in fact if we are loved it's because of the person we already are! Changing changes all that. Reminds me of the old song, "Don't go changing, trying to please me... I love you just the way you are."
Re: All Shook Up 10avln_bbmfanOctober 30 2007, 04:19:17 UTC
Thanks for the comment. Since Ennis and Jack are the only ones who know exactly what they are feeling, and they haven't been able to reveal that to each other, a lot of what Ellie had to say is speculation, based on her experiences and understandings. Same with Jack and Ennis. They are both so worried about the other changing in a way that won't include them that they are actually creating more problems than there really are. I look back at some of the things I did at that age and wish I had spent less time trying to figure out what was going on in someone else's head and more time just asking them. It would have prevented a whole lot of misunderstandings. And I love the reminder of that old song. I don't remember the name of it (damn, it's hell to get old) but it does fit here. :-)
I was so happy to see this update! :) It seems like Jack and Ennis still have a long way to go in their relationship even though they've made a lot of progress. At least they are still together and Ellie is there to listen to them and offer some advice (though I don't think she fully understands everything [then again, J & E have a lot of emotional baggage to deal with, some of it *very* recent as in less than two years] but at least she can take a longer view than they can.) I'm very anxious to read the rest of this chapter now. Thank you for sharing it.
Yes, they have come a long way, but they did have so many more obstacles than most heterosexual couples could ever have. And they are only 20. Young and in love, but yes, they are still together. :-) And yes, Ellie doesn't understand everything, but Jack came to her for help, as clumsy as he was about it, and she is doing the best she can. Relationships are not her forte by any means, but she can at least give somewhat of an objective viewpoint. I had planned to post part b tonight, but it looks like it will be tomorrow night. I want to go through it one more time. I've made so many corrections in the last few days, I want to do a good review before I post it. I have a habit of leaving in stray words or taking out too many when I make adjustments. :-\
Comments 51
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I've been struggling for weeks with this chapter, and mostly with this conversation. I took it out several times, but it kept worming it's way back in. I finally gave up the fight and here it is.
I hope the rest of this chapter doesn't disappoint. :-)
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Fantastic update and so far not a bit corny!!
Gonna ruminate for awhile and wait for the other
parts and make more comments then!!!
Thanks for this update. Been missing this story.
Yeah for Ms. Ellie.
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I apologize for the long delay, but this really has been a difficult chapter to write.
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Bravo, Friend.
CYN
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Thanks for sharing that, CYN. Sometimes that's the way it is, with no real rhyme or reason. It's what makes us all individuals.
I think that when it comes to sex, most of us have something that just doesn't do it for us. Doesn't make that particular act wrong for anyone but us, and having a partner that accepts this is just as important as accepting it for ourselves, IMHO.
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Well, that was unexpected and just what the doctor ordered. Ellie talking to Jack, spelling it out, saying what Jack knew had to be said, and what Ennis was afraid to say. Now, Jack and Ennis have to have 'the talk' themselves.
Interesting, Jack and Ennis both want what they had on Brokeback, and both thought they needed to do something different to get it back. When in fact, all they had to do was be themselves, do what they love the best to the person they love. Guess we should all think about that, thinking we have to change ourselves to be loved, when in fact if we are loved it's because of the person we already are! Changing changes all that. Reminds me of the old song, "Don't go changing, trying to please me... I love you just the way you are."
Thanks again.
Reply
Since Ennis and Jack are the only ones who know exactly what they are feeling, and they haven't been able to reveal that to each other, a lot of what Ellie had to say is speculation, based on her experiences and understandings.
Same with Jack and Ennis. They are both so worried about the other changing in a way that won't include them that they are actually creating more problems than there really are. I look back at some of the things I did at that age and wish I had spent less time trying to figure out what was going on in someone else's head and more time just asking them. It would have prevented a whole lot of misunderstandings.
And I love the reminder of that old song. I don't remember the name of it (damn, it's hell to get old) but it does fit here. :-)
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And yes, Ellie doesn't understand everything, but Jack came to her for help, as clumsy as he was about it, and she is doing the best she can. Relationships are not her forte by any means, but she can at least give somewhat of an objective viewpoint.
I had planned to post part b tonight, but it looks like it will be tomorrow night. I want to go through it one more time. I've made so many corrections in the last few days, I want to do a good review before I post it. I have a habit of leaving in stray words or taking out too many when I make adjustments. :-\
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