Thoughts on Buffy while rewatching bits. <3

[prozacpark]

Have I mentioned lately how much I love Buffy (seasons 1 through 5)? I don't talk about it enough these days but to confirm, it is, in fact, STILL MY LIFE. So, I've been rewatching season one with people in my life who haven't ever watched it(!), and appreciating early bits despite its flaws because it all leads to the awesome series finale of

Comments

[glitterberrys]

Was the Inara/Reavers thing ever confirmed by Joss and co, or was it just a fandom rumor? Because I vaguely remember hearing people saying like "omg that was so going to happen," but I could never trace it back to anything but fan chatter...

I'd totally forgotten that. I stuck my nose into Firefly fandom and ran screaming in, like, a minute. I made one of my best friends there, though, so it's all good. But my god, it's a weird-ass place.

[prozacpark]

I'm pretty sure it came from one of the writers. I read it somewhere on girl-wonder.org, I think. Additionally, what Morena Baccarin has said about the injection bit in the pilot seems to confirm that.

And "Firefly" fandom is a scary place, yes. I watched the show years after it aired and was initially sad about having missed out on the fandom, but the Inara hatred in the fandom is just mind-boggling and scary, among other things.

[glitterberrys]

I remember on the commentary their discussing the injection kit, but not confirming anything. I always thought it was more of a "yeah, Reavers will do that so she's prepared" thing than anything they planned to put into the show. But I didn't stick around long enough to really find out.

Really? I always figured Mal/Inara would be ultrapopular. The pairing I NEVER understood was River/Jayne. His revulsion and hatred? IT"S REAL. It's not fucking sexual tension! But then I'm pretty sure it was just born of "they're both hot so they must be in love" thinking...

[prozacpark]

Dude! YES to River/Jayne. I was going to point that out as part of the reason the fandom scares me, but didn't know if it was secretly your OTP, BUT I AM SO GLAD IT'S NOT. Because, yes, it's creepy. Like, out of everyone on that ship, Jayne has the LEAST amount of tolerance for River's issues, and I can't see their relationship being anything but abusive.

And, well, Inara/Mal *is* popular, which makes the fandom hate Inara for being a slut/whore/whatever who is apparently cheating on him at all times (despite not being in an actual relationship with him!) and not thinking about his feelings ever. Of course, no one blames Mal for disrespecting her and insulting her in front of other people or sleeping with Nandi as actual sex and not a part of his job. Sigh.

[meganbmoore]

There was a time when you hated Faith? I think my worldview was just stattered.

Also, I think you literally IMed me 5 minutes after I went to bed last night.

[prozacpark]

There was also a time when I really, REALLY hated Achilles. Really, I was ODDLY conventional in high school. It's possible that a lot of my rebelling against the authorial intent/fandom is largely a part of the Roswell trauma. ;)

Yes, I wandered off downstairs and forgot I was on. AIM is acting up now, and I have THINGS TO DISCUSS WITH YOU!

[meganbmoore]

Well, I don't think I liked Achilles until we met, so...

Also, I, like, had to promise my firstborn for Trillian to let me on AIM, and it still won't let me on Y! Pager. I do have MSN, though.

[prozacpark]

Awww, I wasn't sure you liked Achilles at all, actually, but I didn't want to ask because I did not want to JUDGE you based on that. ;) I mean, Karen still dislikes him after all my excessive fangirling for years.

And gah, I don't seem to have MSN? And now LJ is acting up, too. HOW AM I SUPPOSED TO ENTERTAIN MYSELF?

[prozacpark]

I wonder if I would've done the same had I watched it now? Since the Faith love does take over everything else to a ridiculous degree for me and my tendency to OTC has increased over the years. I hate most people on Buffy when Faith is around because OMG, WHY CAN'T THEY TREAT HER BETTER? Even though she's insane, violent, and treating them horribly first. ;)

You went back and watched the season four Faith episodes, yes? That's when I fell in love with Faith. <3

[prozacpark]

Oh, the first two seasons are really cheesy. Buffy tends to hit its stride towards the end of season two/season three and then reaches its peak in season five. Season three is my favorite for the Faith love. <3 She's just so wonderfully messed-up, and I love the contrast between the slayer thing being the worst part of Buffy's normal, happy life, but for Faith, it's the best thing that has happened to her, and she tries so hard to make it work, and fails so hard, and I think I maybe love her more for that than if she had done well with it. <3

I have an overprotective streak for underdog characters, even if I simultaneously want to shake them and go "What are you doing???"

Yes, that. And this is especially true when it happens to be a character the fandom collectively hates on.

Oh! Have you read the Faith comics? I hate Buffy comics, but the Faith bits are awesome.

[lyssie]

I... think part of my problem with the show is how... every season follows the same pattern:

Buffy is uncertain! stuff happens. Buffy is uncertain, but someone buffers her and Reminds her not to be! more stuff happens. Buffy saves the world! And then the reset button is hit, because when the next season starts, BUFFY HAS LEARNED NOTHING FROM THE SEASON BEFORE. Rinse. Repeat.

[prozacpark]

Oh, Lyssie. I hate defending things because I'm so much more comfortable pointing out what's WRONG with them. ;) Especially since Buffy is far from perfect.

But I do think Buffy grows as a character and her growth very specifically fits into the genres that the show is working with. The narrative patterns are similar, but I feel the stakes are higher each season, and she makes different choices at key moments ("Becoming" vs. "The Gift" or her treatment of Faith vs. Dawn, etc.)

[lm]

See, I actually feel like she just gradually falls apart over the course of the series. I don't feel like she's terribly strong. Part of that might be because she PHYSICALLY appears weaker and weaker as each season passes. I feel like all that happens to Buffy's growth as a character is she learns more how to get the help she needs.

I really want to still like Buffy the show, and I still do enjoy certain episodes. I just feel like Joss and/or Marti deliberately took a massive dump on almost every single character I liked, that overall I have such a level of rage that it gets in the way of my enjoyment.

[prozacpark]

Oh, I entirely agree, and feel strongly that Joss has this need to deconstruct and destroy his own narratives. But it's been years since I've watched season six and seven, and really have repressed them enough that they're no longer a part of my canon.

Up till season five, I feel like she falls apart on an emotional/mental level, all the while becoming a better SLAYER. And then "The Gift" sort of reconciles those two aspects of her.

I do tend to go into rage when forced to discuss season six and seven, especially with friends who insist those are the best seasons. I also suspect that my lack of rage has to do with the fact that I sort of didn't like most of the characters on Buffy, so I'm invested in it on a narrative level, which is well-done, and don't feel offended by the character butchering? But I understand where you're coming from: I can't rewatch "Angel" because of what Joss did to Cordelia, and just thinking about her fills me with an insane amount of rage.

[oberongeiger]

I'll take season one over six and seven any. freaking. day.

I think one of the main reasons it comes off so dated is because they were shooting on low-grade video for the first year, so it just LOOKS cheap as hell.

[lm]

IMHO "The Pack" is one of the 5 best episodes of the whole series. And to me, monster-of-the-week plots MUST trump the whole bullshit "magic is drugs!" plotline of..uh...season 6? no matter how lame those monsters are.